I switched ISPs today, and had no internet access up until a while ago, so am still not fully caught up. I also have to leave in an hour or so for the next 3-4 hrs. A few, quick things for now:


I should have clarified that I was asking about Today and Today only.


[emphasis added]

I guess you didn't actually mean to include D2 earlier (above quoted post), or did you change your mind since?



I didn't think that I did, but rereading your post, there is something that doesn't quite add up with the purpose and content of the rest of it; no idea, though, if it is what led to her post #452. At the very end, you say:

[emphasis added]

That's true about town-drealmer7. I'd have to go check a scum game or two of his, as I don't really remember if he does that also as scum, but his tunnelling and stubborn refusal to budge is associated with town-drealmer7 in most people's minds.

So, the question I have for you is - if you still don't think she's town, why did you add the drealmer7 reference at the end?


Scum-you, and buddies with trentonlf, would have gone for two other townies N1 because that would tell town that trentonlf, who was Dessimu's N0 read, was not scum? So, town-you planned to clear trentonlf on D2 for that exact reason?



You should have not edited out the rest of my sentence, I made that clarification exactly because of you. Your "I'm always town" is a known, running joke, just like dedoporno's "bitch I might be" thing, but I don't think that medamiedo is joking when she says she's obvitown.


If people don't answer your questions, and it bothers you, poke them until they react. So far, it doesn't seem to really bother you, and that's starting to bother me. And no smart-arse imgur gifs in response, please.

@Bookwyrm: good idea

Well, JMich, I'd like some more input from you. And since I am self-centered I am most interested in your read on my two top scum picks. What are your thoughts on trent and sage?

Few of my thoughts on Dess and why I found him to possibly be scum. my own words are in () anything Dess said is started with Dess says-

post 48:dess says-@Sage: Dess is fine.
Unvote medamiedo, vite Lifthrasil Only a thief would sympathize with another thief. It is a code of a Thief. Clearly scum. Also, killed RVS.
(Why bring up thief - I know its rvs badically but comments on lifts comment we are out to rvs but still metions a power role abit not to this game but a scum role none the less. )

(not to much action between post 48 to 141 but fluff fun and filler.)
post 48-( has lists of who seems to be going at eachother. I found this to possibly trying to lead town a certain. Also pointed out the 3 players seem to have a connection to eachother yogs- bookwyn - lift. Again I felt he was trying to push town a certain way. )
post 145- (re-arranges and or sum them up without filler lifts question to yogs. Why? )

(He was on Lifts ass so much of day one but not voting for him. If he found him that scummy why no vote?)

post 254-Dess says- What I am saying, is, I see you from both perspectives - as top notch town as well as manipulative scum. And at this point I am betting all I have, on you.
I can't argue about the way I look like to you, or trentonlf, or anybody else. That is why I don't break a sweat. But I believe you to be scum; I can and thus, I am pushing this.

(This to me is well ok I can try to play both sides and keep my vote on you but when you flip down I can point back and say oh well I did say he was top notch town but also scummy. I had to pick one and picked wrong. oops)

--------------

@Lift. You really are barking up the wrong tree. Please go back and look at others who are not posting much or contributing much. We can not lose another player in this lynch.

I know how you used/meant the indigestion part, and I didn't miss your post #428, but you spoke of actions and reactions to said actions, which indicates to me that something specific made your gut go into trentonlf's direction.

So, while you voted medamiedo in the meantime, I'd still like an answer - I've got trentonlf as more leaning town than not, but that little question-mark in the back of my head reminds me that I trapped him last game he was scum in a similar way, so he may have upped his game and become more cautious to escape the same fate.



That's not what I meant. You said you too were guilty of not trying to look at a third party after Dessimu's claim. I found that odd coming from the person that was the least convinced of Dessimu's scumminess and the most convinced of yogsloth's one. At least that's how I read your posts.


I'm far from ignoring it, but the way you started this and have been arguing so far for the most part, didn't give me the impression you were looking, let alone focusing on, that far back before the deadline time. If that's the case, I have to reread your relevant posts with this in mind.

And if the bonus points mentioned here are for me, you can take them back - I'm in Europe, so while it wasn't a particularly convenient hour (midday), it was also far from awful. I still don't think that who was online and who wasn't is indicative of who made an effort and who didn't for the deadline expiration, hence also not alignment indicative.



And speaking of the deadline time - @mod, did you miss my post #471? It surely can't be that you're simply ignoring me, can it? ¬_¬



As do I about you, and a good number of others in this game.


My time's up, got to run.

Because that's what it reminded me of, the behavior of "You are scum and can do no right". I haven't made the tunnel connection solely with town!drealmer; he's been scum how many times, twice?

...what? That...doesn't sound at all like what I wrote. Or at least tried to write.

If I were scum buddies with Trent, and town!Dess claimed a N0 investigation on Trent, then I'm a lot less likely to push the "Go for 2" plan on N1 because of the extra risk to scum from the extra investigation. The spike was something of a metaphor for spiking someones tires, or throwing a stick between the spokes of a bicycle wheel.

Therefore if Dessimu is NOT killed N1, then Trent looks less like scum because of the previously mentioned risk. It certainly isn't conclusive proof, but town!me would have marked Dessimu's N1 survival as a point in Trent's favor (contingent on Dess not flipping scum later).

I've had this thought going in the back of my mind that scum are laying back as much as possible and letting town fight each other. So either this gets me lynched or we lynch someone who's trying to hide in plain sight (just posting enough to seem like they are contributing).

So as of right now anyone who's actually been actively participating I will not vote for

Unvote Lift

For me the people who are in the hiding in plain sight category are:

cristi
Sage
Flub
JMich

As I said before flub is one of my top suspects so:
Vote flub

Let's get this party on!

I find him generally floating. I know, it not that unusual for him, but...
I just get the feeling he was quite satisfied with the outcome.
Yes, a lot of it is the fact he didn't post the last day.

I still think Bookwyrm is the more sure scum, but doesn't look like anyone else really agrees. At least they aren't showing it with their vote. He sure is trying hard to discredit game appearance as having any value whatsoever and why is that? I think it's because I'm right and Flub is his scum buddy. I certainly don't like the way he is trying to steer me by telling me how I should be investigating. It's not like I'm not ISOing people and re-reading, it's just I'm not finding enough to make a reasonable case to report about. I mean, yeah, if I want, I can pull out little statements that ping me that virtually everyone has made, but I'm not sure that would be very constructive.

So, I'm on Flub as my 2nd choice, because at least some people seem to agree and it consolidates the votes. The sooner we start consolidating the better so we don't repeat lynching 15 minutes before the deadline. And I using it as an indication that maybe we need to start getting serious. Either way, my best bet is Book/Flub as a team.

As to Trent, I do hate a lot of his actions, so I pushed him. His frustration comes off as sincere though, so I have a mixed bag. I cannot completely discount him faking it, but he's mollified me for now.

As to Meda, again I really don't like the style. I find her quick judgments based on so little to be disconcerting. I really really want to vote her as scum, but two things. She was dedicated at the end of day, and two, I don't like how many have expressed displeasure and specifically certain people (*cough*Book*cough*wyrm*cough*) are making a push on her, that they may be using her as low-hanging fruit.

As to how day 1 formed, I didn't find anything of significance. Either it's primarily town-formed or scum did a solid job in concealing and justifying their moves or I'm just missing it.

As to groups...yeah, I'm trying to look at a lot of different angles. Scum may have tried to secure the cop mislynch (Meda/Trent). Scum may have just stayed absent and let town do all the heavy lifting and thus taking all the blame (Flub/JMich). Scum may be selectively pushing specific mislynches today (too many to list). I'm trying to piece it all together. The pieces just are not quite fitting as well as I'd like them to. Doesn't help that the first two thoughts are mutually exclusive...

I now don't think both Meda and Trent are on the same scum team. I just don't see with 3 scum why they would try to pull off that sort of "extreme distancing" using a new player so early in day 2. But both of them have done enough things I find scummy that I would consider voting either of them in a pinch, but I see it at best a 50/50 proposition. A really good chance one or the other is scum, but is that good enough? I mean, if I'm right about Book and Flub, I'd probably think Trent is the more likely 3rd wheel of the two but I read Meda as more scummy directly.

I wouldn't be particularly unhappy with any of these choices. I think we have a good enough chance to find scum in this pile. But I prefer the first two. If it comes down to it, I'll look at more neutral-leaning players, but I didn't see much I disliked about Cristi's few posts and she showed up when we needed her. Sage might be hiding behind inactivity, but even if she is scum, I'm not sure that leads us to her partners. JMich didn't post in the last day either, but I suspect Flub more and he seems to be pretty cool about it. That stunt in response to Bookwyrm was pure gold.

I thought Hyper was a little more quiet than usual day 1. But given Yog's ploy, I'm writing it off to not wanting to accidentally force a PR slip. Day 2 is making me feel better about him. But nothing really pinged me either day. You, Lift, ping me a tad. I worry that you are tunneling a bit too much, trying too hard to get your way. Still, I think I see where you are coming from, I just don't agree with everything.

Barring any spectacular events, I think this is where I'm at now. At end of day, I'll make the best judgment with my vote that I can. I like the chances of finding scum in those 4, but if consensus is looking another direction, I'll take another look. I have one vote, and we will not get to a lynch without a few more.

I did fill a reply for that but it seems a vote count I did afterwards overwrote it. Apologies.

The original time was actually in my morning but I pushed it half a day on D1. I don't mind extending another half a day if that's fine with everyone but that will be it.


@everyone, would everyone like half a day worth of extension for D1 to make the deadline more comfortable? I figure Town would welcome it and Scum would have to take it to not stand out :)

Then again, I remind you that the deadline is more of a limit rather than a target ;)

As of right now I would be comfortable with voting bookwyn, flub or lift.

I find RW is contributing to trying to find scum and trying to get town to work together so we do not have a last minute lynch. So I am not confirtable voting for him right now.

Meda I was leaning scum day one but as day two progressed I found some of her posts to be town. Though I would like to know why she says lift is 100%. She has gotten quiet the last few actual days (not game days)

Flub I dont fnd much content on his own thinking. He pops in every now and then and likes to just quote a few things here and there and asks simple questions but to me it feel lacking in trying to find scum. And lacking in trying to help town down the right path.

Jmich - Is elusive I am not sure which way he is. Hes on the fence for me.

trent- I have leaning more town. To me is answers questions as to his actions and comments and is trying to hunt scum.

Bookwyn - I have leaning more scum then town. Not a lot of what he has posted sticks out to me I find that he is trying to look like he is here but not realy here like I would like to see. He agrees with my comment on the times. But he is almost making way to big of a deal about it. When it was said and anyone can take it as it is and use it how they want. Why beat it to death anymore

Cristigal- I honestly have no clue yet. Not very activtive but I like her posts when she does post.

Hyper - I have leaning down. I like his question and find him trying to hunt scum and find out all the information he can to do that. He is taking notes and catching some good points others are saying and calling them out on it.

We need to work together in this. I unvote lift and vote flub I am comfortable with voting Flub from his posts to his inactivity but I am also very open to voting bookwyn or lift.

Trent doesn't feel right to me. Have to read Sage again, but I don't recall anything in particular popping up.

Actions and reactions. You mean post 441, where meda asks me to go on something more than gut feeling, and I say that gut feelings (aka indigestion) is the only thing we have?
Anyway, look at , [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/forum_mafia_47_it_tastes_like_chicken_you_wont_believe_its_flavorless/post26]#26 (though this could be skipped as a joke post), (was that a typo on wyrm's part or a slip?), [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/forum_mafia_47_it_tastes_like_chicken_you_wont_believe_its_flavorless/post269]#269, the unvote and revote in and [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/forum_mafia_47_it_tastes_like_chicken_you_wont_believe_its_flavorless/post318]#318, the congratulating of the doctor in , [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/forum_mafia_47_it_tastes_like_chicken_you_wont_believe_its_flavorless/post361]#361 where he declares a player as town without explaining why, and [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/forum_mafia_47_it_tastes_like_chicken_you_wont_believe_its_flavorless/post376]#376 in conjuction with and (less so) [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/forum_mafia_47_it_tastes_like_chicken_you_wont_believe_its_flavorless/post294]#294, though he does try to reverse it in #381. A lot of small things that individually mean nothing, but all together are cause for indigestion.

On the other hand, I'm still waiting to see why meda believes Lift to be town. Should meda flip scum, it would be quite interesting to see Lift's alignment afterwards.


@Dedo: I'm fine either way for the extension .

JMich, how do you feel about Meda's voting habits from D1?

New forum, new habits. See an eyebrow raising post, vote. I personally find switching votes often inefficient, but others seem to think it helps.

I am good with an extension for the deadline, but to be honest I wish there was no need for one at all. I don't think we will ever get to the point where we don't need one though sadly :-(

Alright. I was going through D1 to collect a voting record (to be posted later, when I've finished some analysis I want to do first). I was wondering how some of her shenanigan votes fit with [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/forum_mafia_47_it_tastes_like_chicken_you_wont_believe_its_flavorless/post72]posts.

Dedo I am fine with the extension. Would half a day be 12 hours? As in move it from 6am to 6 pm?