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A group calling themselves Empress just managed to break through Denuvo 7 you can read about it here
https://crackwatch.com/game/mortal-kombat-11/cracks/mortal-kombat-11-empress

What I found interesting and the reason I bring this is because I want you to check out the NFO and read what it says. I found it quite profound with the way it talk about DRM.

"If you don't own it, you're better off without it" no arguing with that.
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Denuvo can suck my balls
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McMicroDonalds: What I found interesting and the reason I bring this is because I want you to check out the NFO and read what it says
Here's an image of the NFO for anyone who can't into "Crackwatch". I guess groups have sub-reddits now. I'll also try to transcribe, for anyone who can't into "reddit" or PNGs:

"""Release Notes. What I said about 95% of the scene still stands. I am glad to see the 5% waking up but for how long? Can those 5% carry the whole scene, while others do nothing? Denuvo is not the only problem now, there is already other dunuvo like DRM popping up in several games now with example being the newly released "Raji An Ancient Epic". This is why I told you what my mission is and why I put so much dedication into it. People who defend DRM - don't wait till your trip and fall and have your own shitty limitation experience to start getting aware of the problem, because by the time you do ... it will most definitely be too late for the whole gaming industry. PS: If you don't own it, then you are better off without it, right? Think about that. Reminder: The reason why Ubisoft, EA, and such companies never remove denuvo from their games is only because the LOVE feeling *superior* and ENJOY seeing you the customer as PIGS under their control or worse. If you want to be a *slave* for those nasty evil bastards, it's your choice ... just don't dare to call yourself a man or even a human being afterwards, cause you would have lost that already."""
Interesting news, I doubt it will do much good though.

Because most likely, the Denuvo bosses will just pay their devs to do another massive re-write of the code so that it isn't cracked any more in the newest version.

Then the cracking scene will take many more eons to crack it again, apparently...in which case even after they do, that still won't accomplish anything long-term, as the cycle will simply start over again. Just like it already has been doing in recent years.

In other words, Denuvo is still winning.
Post edited October 18, 2020 by Ancient-Red-Dragon
That's not surprising
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McMicroDonalds: What I found interesting and the reason I bring this is because I want you to check out the NFO and read what it says
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drm9009: Here's an image of the NFO for anyone who can't into "Crackwatch".
Is crackwatch blocked or something for some people. There's no actual cracks on the site or anything.
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Ancient-Red-Dragon: Interesting news, I doubt it will do much good though.

Because most likely, the Denuvo bosses will just pay their devs to do another massive re-write of the code so that it isn't cracked any more in the newest version.

Then the cracking scene will take many more eons to crack it again, apparently...in which case even after they do, that still won't accomplish anything long-term, as the cycle will simply start over again. Just like it already has been doing in recent years.

In other words, Denuvo is still winning.
I think there's hope yet. Also you must bare in mind that the DRM industry is just as cutthroat as any other. For all we know these could be agents working for a competing DRM company. Furthermore they have a bitcoin address; so they're able to get a little funding too.

However, there are less and less games that use DRM that I even want to play. In the end DRM will lose because those who support it are bringing about their own destruction, just like the NFO says. Only those who truly own their games will have something to fall back on.
Post edited October 18, 2020 by McMicroDonalds
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Modern social media offers the best solution to heavy DRMd games. Cancel them. Not just not buying but getting a copyright infringed version. Just ignore them off completely; scoff them. At least those of us that still do care even/regardless if the majority does appear to not do so. At the very least for your own dignity.
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McMicroDonalds: ..
However, there are less and less games that use DRM that I even want to play. ...
True that. Can't remember when last time I was really disappointed about a single player game using online-drm. I guess Skyrim. And by now its an old game.
Post edited October 18, 2020 by Anothername
Does that mean it is now "instantly" cracked for all Denuvo 7 games, or is it the same long ordeal for each new game with Denuvo? At least the process for the cracking is now known?

When is Denuvo 8 due then? Or will they jump straight to 9 while they are at it?
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drm9009: (Crackers wrote:)
"Reminder: The reason why Ubisoft, EA, and such companies never remove denuvo from their games is only because the LOVE feeling *superior* and ENJOY seeing you the customer as PIGS under their control or worse. If you want to be a *slave* for those nasty evil bastards, it's your choice ... just don't dare to call yourself a man or even a human being afterwards, cause you would have lost that already."
Too much hyperbole.

Logically thinking, the reason most publishers are so pro-DRM is because:

1. They hate the mere thought of losing control of their product (hence, potentially any extra revenue). I think it is quite human, in essence it is the same feeling why I am anti-DRM, ie. I don't want to buy a product over whose (whomstd've?) usage I don't have control, like that I can't play it at some point anymore because the publisher decides so or the service from which I bought it goes defunct. From their point of view, they hate the idea I get to decide where and when and with whom I might be playing the game, if there is even a slight possibility having a stricter control over the purchase could yield another purchase of the product.

So even if a game made lots of money, the mere thought that there are possibly some people playing it without paying irks many publishers to no end.

This reminds me of a couple of years ago when a Finnish, quite popular and successful, female singer artists commented on a court case of a small girl (or most probably her father) downloading an illicit mp3 of her song. (The father was told to pay the law firm thousands of euros or go to court, so he (probably foolishly) chose to go to court; yes it was one of those cases where a law firm sends "pay up or else" letters to alleged pirates.)

I guess the public was expecting her to show at least some veiled compassion and understanding to the family (because of how she seems to depict herself as a quite leftist, humane, compassionate etc. person in her songs), but instead she was very harsh and went on and on on how wrong it is that some people try to listen to HER music for free etc., and didn't show any compassion at all towards the family. In essence, she seemed to feel the family got what they deserved.

I am not saying that artist was wrong (generally speaking I am anti-piracy, except in e.g. cases where I feel piracy is the only way to save some work of art from disappearing from the face of the earth), and I can understand how she feels jealous and protective of her own songs, but the public still seemed somewhat surprised by her harsh reaction to the case.

2. Some publishers may have a more pragmatic approach that "maximize early profits with stricter DRM early when the game is released, even if it inconveniences the customers somewhat, and then maybe later remove the DRM when it matters less to pirates". So they aren't really gung-ho pro-DRM, merely think about it pragmatically.

No I don't think there is any of this "Haha you customers are just peeeegs! Squeel for me!".
Post edited October 18, 2020 by timppu
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drm9009: """Release Notes. PS: If you don't own it, then you are better off without it, right? Think about that. Reminder: The reason why Ubisoft, EA, and such companies never remove denuvo from their games is only because the LOVE feeling *superior* and ENJOY seeing you the customer as PIGS under their control or worse. If you want to be a *slave* for those nasty evil bastards, it's your choice ..."""
Yeah....

It's rants like these why anti-DRM approach doesn't get taken seriously outside small DRM-free circles.

Ignoring some ridiculous internal contradictions there, like being a slave being a choice which it never is, and talking about ownership when the entire piracy is based on violating legal ownership, that statement doesn't make sense otherwise either.

I don't think using DRM gives any pleasure to companies, as they have to pay for that and create legal contracts and all that. It's a simple calculation on what is profitable. Maybe those companies sometimes get that calculation wrong, but as there has been DRM since the 80s, they probably benefit from it one way or the other too.

The best thing would be to ignore DRM games entirely, and ignore cracks for those even more. Now that would send a message for sure! If DRM-free games alone would generate profit, it would take only a couple of months for the industry to abandon DRM.

The problem is that often those who oppose DRM the loudest, only want to get their games for free, which in turn justifies using DRM in the first place!
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McMicroDonalds: Is crackwatch blocked or something for some people. There's no actual cracks on the site or anything.
I was skeptical about it by the name and figured some people might feel similarly.
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Denuvo is an awesome DRM? I can agree with games that lock-in multiplayer or actual game features locking players into an always on-line environment suck balls. But Denuvo as a DRM has been very lightweight and made piracy largely a thing of the past.

Anyway, saying this as someone who loves old games, you guys are probably more recent users of GoG.
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Ancient-Red-Dragon: Because most likely, the Denuvo bosses will just pay their devs to do another massive re-write of the code so that it isn't cracked any more in the newest version.
The problem is not Denuvo itself, the problem are the people which support it, which buy DRM'ed games and give the developers the money to rewrite it and "improve" it further.
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Ancient-Red-Dragon: In other words, Denuvo is still winning.
Sure, as long as people support it, it will.
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Chromanin: Denuvo is an awesome DRM? I can agree with games that lock-in multiplayer or actual game features locking players into an always on-line environment suck balls. But Denuvo as a DRM has been very lightweight and made piracy largely a thing of the past.

Anyway, saying this as someone who loves old games, you guys are probably more recent users of GoG.
Can't agree with you on this one mate. Denuvo is known to hinder performance, but even if it didn't there's a nasty side to it. Denuvo isn't really DRM itself but a safeguard against DRM being hacked. In this example it allows Steam to tether the game to the hardware. So even if you're playing in offline mode, the moment you change your hardware you will have to re verify your game; sorry their game cause you don't own anything.
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Chromanin: But Denuvo as a DRM has been very lightweight and made piracy largely a thing of the past.
Denuvo has caused multiple performance issues in many games:-

- Massively increased load times. Even point & click adventure games, Denuvo turned out to the difference between the game starting in 47s vs 7s. People who usually say "But, but I didn't notice any difference" by benchmarking only avg fps are missing the point it impacts a whole lot more than that.

- In above Syberia 3 link, even the save / config files turned out to be encrypted and incompatible with other versions.

- When multi-layered with VMProtect (Ubisoft style), CPU issues have been observed with up to 30-40% higher spikes. It is the exact opposite of "lightweight".

- Hardware locks. Apply a "No-CD" that removes a CD check and it's gone for good, even 20-40 years later. Any DRM that locks the game to specific CPU architecture for which cracks merely attempt to mimic runs the risk of not working in future years if architecture changes significantly.

- Many Denuvo'd games won't work under Linux + Wine, and yet magically start working the day Denuvo is removed...

- Future source port legality. ScummVM can bypass old copy protection (manual / code word checks) because the authors gave permission. Future source ports in years to come though for legal reasons may not be able to include 3rd party DRM removal the same way they can with 1st party, even if the developers of the game agree.
Post edited October 19, 2020 by AB2012