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Oh, but I supported my claim. You were just too lazy to read it. As I said before, stop derailing this thread. We were back at DEFCON and suddenly another ignorant spun from the cracks of earth with his ridiculous self entitlement.
I read it. I even quoted the part that disproved you. Then you claimed that I should find the part that somehow supported your view that didn't exist.

I mean you've spent around 15 or so posts going ON and ON about how I am too stupid to read the support for your view, but you have zero times cited any source or info source at all except one post which I demonstrated does not support your views. And you continue to claim it supports your views, but you can't cite any part of it that does....

Talk about derailing.
Post edited July 28, 2015 by jsjrodman
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jsjrodman: I read it. I even quoted the part that disproved you. Then you claimed that I should find the part that somehow supported your view that didn't exist.
What are you even talking about? I you to bring support for your claim. You responded with this [url=http://www.gog.com/forum/general/release_victor_vran_92633/post671]statement. And I quote: "On the steam forums, which you can read yourself, the developers state that the logic for selecting drops is implemented on their servers."
I asked you for proof, you told me to search it myself. As opposed to my action of pointing you to a quote from a user who actually read those Steam forums which you so vehemently claim you've read. And here's the post! As for the discussion, I told you once. A multiplayer feature is a multiplayer feature. Just like Leaderboards for score, Deathmatch and Co-Op for interaction, so are the codes for a social aspect. I've explained this time and time again. A multiplayer feature. Instead of codes you get basic loot in singleplayer, because guess what? The codes wouldn't make any sense in singleplayer! You want cheats? Go to the console command.
And, if I may. You have incredibly ugly double standards. I;m the first to tell you to bring proof and you reply for me to search for proof for your statements on my own, and then challenge my statements. That's the dumbest falacy ever.
Further proof of your ignorance can be found here. As I pointed out, this is a social feature, which, just like co-op, requires online. Does it impede the game? No. Do you need internet to play the game? No. Do you need to authenticate the game? No. Do you need internet to play online and use the social features? Well obviously yes. Like duh!
Please tell me more how you are able to play Alien vs Predator online without Galaxy or how you are able to access leaderboards for Guilty Gear.
I've explained it once , yet you ignorantly [url=http://www.gog.com/forum/general/release_victor_vran_92633/post660]thought of a social multiplayer feature as of DRM because not everything was added in the offline option. Please tell me more of how you played Deathmatch in Alien vs Predator. /endsarcasm
Again, for you and all the ignorants. It's a social feature. Since you so vehemently play the game singleplayer, why in the hell would you even care? If you want singleplayer in AvP, play singleplayer. Don't play Deathmatch. The game doesn't phone home to authenticate, the game works drm free, all the files are there, the game has multiplayer features for people whom enjoy playing video games with their friends from far away. Calling this DRM is like calling any game with multiplayer features DRM. But, as someone before me said, and said it best, you just want to be right, in spite of the facts being against you.

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jsjrodman: Talk about derailing.
The thread was just fine and back to it's original discussion until an idiot like you found his way here to derail it again. Sadly I must be the one teaching you logic and manners.
You had not yet, in our discussion, claimed that the feature was multiplayer. It is indeed a claim that attempts to support your position. However, it is a false claim. The feature is active in non-multiplayer games, so it is not a multiplayer-only feature.

The post states that it only works online. That is what i referred to in support of the idea that it is an online-only feature which is controlled by server-side logic.

So do you have any *other* claims to support the view that this game does not have features that are server-side controlled?

As a side note the use of "teaching you .. manners" in the above post is .. well, ironic.
Post edited July 28, 2015 by jsjrodman
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jsjrodman: You had not yet, in our discussion, claimed that the feature was multiplayer. It is indeed a claim that attempts to support your position.
I made that claim multiple times. Read the thread again.

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jsjrodman: However, it is a false claim. The feature is active in non-multiplayer games, so it is not a multiplayer-only feature.
Proof? Examples? All you do is bark, but when it comes to standing up to your point you always fail.

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jsjrodman: The post states that it only works online. That is what i referred to in support of the idea that it is an online-only feature which is controlled by server-side logic.
So? It is a feature meant for a social experience. If you want a singleplayer experience, then why would you want this? You make no sense.

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jsjrodman: So do you have any *other* claims to support the view that this game does not have features that are server-side controlled?
I never said the game doesn't have features that are server side controlled. I said calling them DRM is simply stupid and irrational. You see, multiplayer, leaderboards, social experiences. All have one thing in common, and that is the online component. You don't like them? Don't engage in them. Simple as that. However you don't get to speak for the entire userbase of GOG, and proof of that is that the game is #1 in popularity right now.

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jsjrodman: As a side note the use of "teaching you .. manners" in the above post is .. well, ironic.
Maybe so, but out of both of us I'm the one that brings proof for arguments.
Also, you can take the bike now.
I'll easily believe you made that claim in that thread. I saw people discussing and disproving it repeatedly. You did not make it to me when I asked if you had support for your claim.

What do you want to understand that treasure hunt codes drop in single player online games? Do you not believe this occurs?
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jsjrodman: I'll easily believe you made that claim in that thread. I saw people discussing and disproving it repeatedly.
Oh really? Mind to link a few posts? All I saw was a bunch of ignorants I proved wrong and then they started screaming out of self entitlement. Again. All you do is bark but no bite.

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jsjrodman: You did not make it to me when I asked if you had support for your claim.
I linked you the posts once. All you have to do is click on them to read. It's that easy. How dense can you be?

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jsjrodman: What do you want to understand that treasure hunt codes drop in single player online games? Do you not believe this occurs?
What are you even asking? I told you to bring proof and examples of this feature being in non multiplayer games.

I quote:
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jsjrodman: The feature is active in non-multiplayer games, so it is not a multiplayer-only feature.
Proof? Examples? If you don't have any, the bike is there. -------->
The post you linked to did not claim that treasure hunt codes are multiplayer only.

I ask again, do you believe treasure hunt codes never happen in online single player games? Can you respond in a yes/no fashion?
Post edited July 28, 2015 by jsjrodman
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jsjrodman: The post you linked to did not claim that treasure hunt codes are multiplayer only.
No, but do you have proof they are not?

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jsjrodman: I ask again, do you believe treasure hunt codes never happen in online single player games? Can you respond in a yes/no fashion?
No, I don't want to answer your question since you never indulge to answer my questions. This and I can't answer the question since I haven't purchased the game to try myself, nor do I care enough to search for proof just for you when you can't even be bothered to bring proof of your statements.
Post edited July 28, 2015 by HijacK
So again, you wish me to provide evidence for some particular thing, but you choose not to define what it is that I'm required to prove.

And then you claim that I've failed to provide proof for it.

Okay.

----

In any event, when discussing the feature, no suggestion of it being limited to multiplayer is made. Given that this post is specifically there to clarify to people when they can and cannot expect these drops, it seems quite doubtful that it is limited to multiplayer.

Similarly, the Q&A thread clearly identifies you must be online, but no mention of multiplayer is made.

Do you have anything which suggests that this feature somehow requires multiplayer?
Post edited July 28, 2015 by jsjrodman
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jsjrodman: So again, you wish me to provide evidence for some particular thing, but you choose not to define what it is that I'm required to prove.
Again, you either have a mental illness and don't realize what you're saying, or you simply have poor education and can't understand the very thing you have written. Let me quote for a third time: "The feature is active in non-multiplayer games, so it is not a multiplayer-only feature. "

You've said this. You prove it. I didn't call anything here.

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jsjrodman: And then you claim that I've failed to provide proof for it.
I'm still waiting for this social feature to be shown present in any single player games. Entertain us. I once again ask for examples.

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jsjrodman: In any event, when discussing the feature, no suggestion of it being limited to multiplayer is made. Given that this post is specifically there to clarify to people when they can and cannot expect these drops, it seems quite doubtful that it is limited to multiplayer.

Similarly, the Q&A thread clearly identifies you must be online, but no mention of multiplayer is made.

Do you have anything which suggests that this feature somehow requires multiplayer?
Are leaderboards multiplayer? No. Are they a component of multiplayer? Yes. Is this a social feature that requires players to exchange interaction? Yes. Is it online? Yes. Can you solo treasure hunts? Sure. Can you do them as a group? Again, sure.
Regardless, you once again drop the issue at hand and change the subject because you can't properly come up with a proper argument. We were talking about whether this is DRM. You instead talk about semantics and the difference between multiplayer, online, and whether social interactions should be classified as multiplayer. Regarding this semantics, I tell you one last time. If you want to play only singleplayer and don't share any code with anyone why do you give a damn? Just play your game and get rewarded with loot.

As for this whole fiasco, you and the others who argue only about semantics and miss facts bore me. Go sing to another table if you're unable to back your own words.
Since you refuse to stick to any point of debate, it's pretty disingenuous to claim I'm changing the subject In fact when asked if I had understood the subject properly, you refused to even answer the question!

I've offered reasonable circumstantial evidence which points to the idea that this functionality is not limited to multiplayer mode.

The reason I asked for you to define what I'm supposed to prove is because you are so eager to re-frame the debate at every opportunity.

I've provided reasonable support for the idea that there are features which are restricted by online servers. Features that there is no fundamental reason that they must be so-restricted. Indeed, the developers themselves suggest you can keep this experience entirely to yourself and that it's designed that you are able to do so. If you fel the need to debate whether randomized quests can be implemented offline, I suppose we can do that too.

Now you wish to move the point of debate to whether this is DRM or not. Online servers that control access to some game content, but not most, is a thing that different people will see in different ways. I do see it as DRM, because it controls access to some of the single-player game content I (theoretically) paid for. Others may not.

Given that it's a point of debate, and likely will be decided by any individual reader of the comments, I specifically did not use that term to label the game in this sequence one way or another.

So, unless you have some new information to bring, instead of posturing and wind, I think you've just agreed with me.
Post edited July 28, 2015 by jsjrodman
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jsjrodman: Since you refuse to stick to any point of debate, it's pretty disingenuous to claim I'm changing the subject
I have only told you to back your words. You once again fail. It's worse than arguing with a Jehovah's witness.

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jsjrodman: I've offered reasonable circumstantial evidence which points to the idea that this functionality is not limited to multiplayer mode.
Really? Is that so? Care to link me to the post that did that? All I see you do is change the subject.

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jsjrodman: The reason I asked for you to define what I'm supposed to prove is because you are so eager to reframe the debate at every opportunity.
And once again you stand corrected. I told you to back your words. Even quoted your very words a third time and told you, just like in the beginning, to bring any kind of proof. So far nothing.

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jsjrodman: I've provided reasonable support for the idea that there are features which are restricted by online servers. Features that there is no fundamental reason that they must be so-restricted. Indeed, the developers themselves suggest you can keep this experience entirely to yourself and that it's designed that you are able to do so.
Features which are meant to be online. What is your point again? You argue about things which are irrelevant. Maybe this was your intention to begin with.

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jsjrodman: Now you wish to move the point of debate to whether this is DRM or not. Online servers that control access to some game content, but not most, is a thing that different people will see in different ways. I do see it as DRM, because it controls access to some of the single-player game content I (theoretically) paid for. Others may not.
Yes, because you should also have access to world leaderboards while in singleplayer, right? /endsarcasm
Your point is moot. Not only that but you lack substance. The very genesis of this argument has been whether this is DRM or not, hence why there are more than 1000 posts on the Victor Vran release thread. You once again pull a strawman and act as if you don't know what I'm talking about when this argument has gone for over 24 hours now.

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jsjrodman: Given that it's a point of debate, and likely will be decided by any individual reader of the comments, I specifically did not use that term to label the game in this sequence one way or another.
What term did you even use? I can't even recall you having a say about the game in the past 24 hours outside of ridiculous arguments on the release thread of how the game is DRM'd.

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jsjrodman: So, unless you have some new information to bring, instead of posturing and wind, I think you've just agreed with me.
Unless your point is that you make no sense, pull strawmen, can't back your claims, and see every little multiplayer feature as DRM, I can't say we agree on what We think you're saying.
You're going to have to specifically find a new topic for me to back for you, because in the only one you clearly identified, I've already done so. here.

Otherwise, we seem to be in agreement that the game Victor Vran has content that is part of the single-player experience which has its access gated by online code.
Post edited July 28, 2015 by jsjrodman
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jsjrodman: You're going to have to specifically find a new topic for me to back for you, because in the only one you clearly identified, I've already done so. [urlhttps://www.gog.com/forum/general/defcons_drm_is_still_active_support_doesnt_give_a_crap/post477]here.[/ur l]
How exactly does that prove it is not a social feature, hence the need of player interaction? Furthermore, how does that make it DRM? In Far Cry 3 the leaderboards are accessible through a stone in the game that is available regardless of your connectivity to the internet, but in order to register your score, just like in any fighting game, you require the connection. Not directly a multiplayer feature, but not a singleplayer either. Just like in Far Cry 3, let's say you can access those treasure hunts (without definite proof of this we're only assuming and so far you were unable to prove this; developer statements just like PR are always ambiguous, unless you don't realize in what world you live), but to register these codes, for obvious reasons you require to be connected. Because here's the thing, if you don't want to be connected, just play the game singleplayer as a singleplayer game without any social aspect is meant to be played. Alone. You want codes to make your time easier? Well, then. How is this any different from just going in the game console and spawning any kind of weapon for yourself?