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"China" returned 100 posts
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WeirdoGeek: I didn't say Steam didn't pull games of the store. I said they only do so when the devs request it. They don't it for the sorry reason GOG is doing it. I also said that I completely understood and had no problem with wanting a market in China. However, I refuse to believe that these "many gamers" make up a big enough number to basically speak for China as a whole and in fact, there is solid reason to believe these many gamers are just trolls, bots and people who were simply hired in the name of making the response bigger. If GOG has the means to disprove these theories, they are more than welcome to speak up and do so.

I'm well aware no company is perfect and that no matter which one you side with, it is practically guaranteed you are going to have to face the situation of them doing something you don't like and having to take the bad with the good. With Steam, I've yet to face a situation so bad that I simply cannot support them anymore.

This sorry situation where GOG canceled the release and gave a less than half-assed reason is unacceptable. Saying it is happening because "many gamers" demanded it only served to make them look like they got bullied by a bunch of trolls and caved in to their demands. I don't want the future of gaming to be one where people like the "gamers" that did this nonsense decide or at least have a major say in what games the stores are allowed to sell and I choose to fight this by not giving GOG my money.
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SuperLibby72: It's just a little silly you want to boycott GOG over not selling a game that was never in their store. But you are okay supporting a company working with CCP directly. Value made the special steam just for china so that CCP can control and censorship it's own people. But I guess since this is not affecting you, steam the lesser evil. If you want to support steam I don't care, just pointing out they're no better than GOG.
They promised Red Candle that they were and they made an official announcement and store page for it, is the thing. We didn't just look at GOG and completely out of the blue go "YOU! SELL DEVOTION NOW OR WE'RE BOYCOTTING YOU!". Also, regardless of how many trolls insist this is "just a walking simulator" or "some flash in the pan everyone is going to forget about next week", a lot of people really want this game to see release.

I've been waiting myself since pretty much the beginning. I remember waiting so long for that texture to get replaced and then being so devastated and a little pissed at Red Candle when they made that tweet saying they decided they weren't putting the game back up after all.

As another user has said before, if China wants to censor or ban the sale of certain games on THEIR OWN storefronts, that's their business and they wouldn't be the only country to do this. Their troll-bot army should not be making this decision for the rest of the world.

Also, exactly how does this Chinese Steam differ from ours and how do I know it isn't the case for other countries to have their own version of Steam as well?
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SuperLibby72: It's just a little silly you want to boycott GOG over not selling a game that was never in their store. But you are okay supporting a company working with CCP directly. Value made the special steam just for china so that CCP can control and censorship it's own people. But I guess since this is not affecting you, steam the lesser evil. If you want to support steam I don't care, just pointing out they're no better than GOG.
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Linko64: I know this isn't going to the heart of the issue but still -

Steam don't sell themselves as 'for da gamers by da gamers!' then go onto to say 'well, we would sell the game, but the gamers said not to'

The problem GOG has ran into is a wider angle of their issues in general - They don't know how to communicate.

You can't blow all the trumpets saying you're for preservation and have bios like ''Truly gamer friendly DRM-free online gaming platform. Classic & new PC games, great offers, friendly staff, awesome community!'' then go on to cite pulling a game due to 'da gamers' while leaving behind a chunk of offline installers and then also displaying a lack of inability, or care, to talk to your community. This is where the backlash comes from
It's little off topic on what I was saying but get what your saying.
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SuperLibby72: It's just a little silly you want to boycott GOG over not selling a game that was never in their store. But you are okay supporting a company working with CCP directly. Value made the special steam just for china so that CCP can control and censorship it's own people. But I guess since this is not affecting you, steam the lesser evil. If you want to support steam I don't care, just pointing out they're no better than GOG.
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WeirdoGeek: They promised Red Candle that they were and they made an official announcement and store page for it, is the thing. We didn't just look at GOG and completely out of the blue go "YOU! SELL DEVOTION NOW OR WE'RE BOYCOTTING YOU!". Also, regardless of how many trolls insist this is "just a walking simulator" or "some flash in the pan everyone is going to forget about next week", a lot of people really want this game to see release.

I've been waiting myself since pretty much the beginning. I remember waiting so long for that texture to get replaced and then being so devastated and a little pissed at Red Candle when they made that tweet saying they decided they weren't putting the game back up after all.

As another user has said before, if China wants to censor or ban the sale of certain games on THEIR OWN storefronts, that's their business and they wouldn't be the only country to do this. Their troll-bot army should not be making this decision for the rest of the world.

Also, exactly how does this Chinese Steam differ from ours and how do I know it isn't the case for other countries to have their own version of Steam as well?
Do not remember Gabe Newell going to china to expand steam? Steam was block in china for sometime. You can find spared folder in steam for china ( called steamchina ) https://www.reddit.com/r/Steam/comments/kd47xh/steamchina/ China has there own version of steam to control it.
Post edited January 25, 2021 by SuperLibby72
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Linko64: I know this isn't going to the heart of the issue but still -

Steam don't sell themselves as 'for da gamers by da gamers!' then go onto to say 'well, we would sell the game, but the gamers said not to'

The problem GOG has ran into is a wider angle of their issues in general - They don't know how to communicate.

You can't blow all the trumpets saying you're for preservation and have bios like ''Truly gamer friendly DRM-free online gaming platform. Classic & new PC games, great offers, friendly staff, awesome community!'' then go on to cite pulling a game due to 'da gamers' while leaving behind a chunk of offline installers and then also displaying a lack of inability, or care, to talk to your community. This is where the backlash comes from
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SuperLibby72: It's little off topic on what I was saying but get what your saying.
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WeirdoGeek: They promised Red Candle that they were and they made an official announcement and store page for it, is the thing. We didn't just look at GOG and completely out of the blue go "YOU! SELL DEVOTION NOW OR WE'RE BOYCOTTING YOU!". Also, regardless of how many trolls insist this is "just a walking simulator" or "some flash in the pan everyone is going to forget about next week", a lot of people really want this game to see release.

I've been waiting myself since pretty much the beginning. I remember waiting so long for that texture to get replaced and then being so devastated and a little pissed at Red Candle when they made that tweet saying they decided they weren't putting the game back up after all.

As another user has said before, if China wants to censor or ban the sale of certain games on THEIR OWN storefronts, that's their business and they wouldn't be the only country to do this. Their troll-bot army should not be making this decision for the rest of the world.

Also, exactly how does this Chinese Steam differ from ours and how do I know it isn't the case for other countries to have their own version of Steam as well?
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SuperLibby72: Do not remember Gabe Newell going to china to expand steam? Steam was block in china for sometime. You can find spared folder in steam for china ( called steamchina ) https://www.reddit.com/r/Steam/comments/kd47xh/steamchina/ China has there own version of steam to control it.
Well, it's my opinion that Steam is still the lesser evil and this special store does not excuse GOG from what they did. I not saying that's what you said. This is just what I believe.
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SuperLibby72: It's little off topic on what I was saying but get what your saying.

Do not remember Gabe Newell going to china to expand steam? Steam was block in china for sometime. You can find spared folder in steam for china ( called steamchina ) https://www.reddit.com/r/Steam/comments/kd47xh/steamchina/ China has there own version of steam to control it.
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WeirdoGeek: Well, it's my opinion that Steam is still the lesser evil and this special store does not excuse GOG from what they did. I not saying that's what you said. This is just what I believe.
Fair enough and agree doesn't excuse GOG from what they did. Maybe one-day GOG change for the better.
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SuperLibby72: It's just a little silly you want to boycott GOG over not selling a game that was never in their store.
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B1tF1ghter: Your argument is void since product page was clearly live for few hours before the "many gamers" happened.
https://web.archive.org/web/20201216100054/https://www.gog.com/game/devotion

It's especially void since you used that argument to compare GOG to Steam - which is hilarious - since in THIS CASE Steam actually had it for sale for around 6 days - and in Steam case it was brought down by developers themsevles and NOT Valve - so Steam case is nowhere near comparable.

edit:
Ladies and gentleman I found another flaw (cringe) in this ancient forum software of GOG. Apparently it refuses to properly parse webarchive link and behaves like there is nothing before last " https ".
Ergo, you have to manually copy paste the link I posted as otherwise it directs stright to GOG and not webarchive (enirely fault of forum software used here).
This has been posted before but Steam has been accused of blocking games for political reasons

https://gamerant.com/hong-kong-protest-game-china-ban-steam/

and they have remained quiet just as GOG has.
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B1tF1ghter: Your argument is void since product page was clearly live for few hours before the "many gamers" happened.
https://web.archive.org/web/20201216100054/https://www.gog.com/game/devotion

It's especially void since you used that argument to compare GOG to Steam - which is hilarious - since in THIS CASE Steam actually had it for sale for around 6 days - and in Steam case it was brought down by developers themsevles and NOT Valve - so Steam case is nowhere near comparable.

edit:
Ladies and gentleman I found another flaw (cringe) in this ancient forum software of GOG. Apparently it refuses to properly parse webarchive link and behaves like there is nothing before last " https ".
Ergo, you have to manually copy paste the link I posted as otherwise it directs stright to GOG and not webarchive (enirely fault of forum software used here).
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wolfsite: This has been posted before but Steam has been accused of blocking games for political reasons

https://gamerant.com/hong-kong-protest-game-china-ban-steam/

and they have remained quiet just as GOG has.
There is a differene between shaky-ground accusation and a fact.
As well as "refused to list it at all and didn't make public statement" (which btw, any store can, and since stores different than Steam ususally don't accept "just about everything" you just don't get to hear about it most of the time in other stores, like, you never officially know what for example Origin refuses and such, I'm not saying it's good that Steam refuses, but they also have specific content guidlances and if a game is going too far they can just refuse it, also without having access to official Valve reason stated to developer it's still just speculation) and "signed a distribution deal, made product page live and pulled out few hours later stating no-proof highly questionable reason".
I have read some articles on your linked Valve case and so far I have not seen a solid evidence or even hint that that could be DEFINITELY due to "censorship" or anything close to it.
All these articles basically go by "we made yet another controversial game, got rejected on one of distribution platforms and we got upset so we decided to publicize it without providing details so people can speculate and publicly shame Valve while our games get free publicity".
If developers bring it to the public while refusing to give exact quotation it's basically biased fearmongering and it's hard not to see it as a form of "let's make it controversial so it gets viral and our games get promoted for completely free".
If there would be legitimate concern why not just publicize quoted proofs? Think about it.
Valve blocks a lot of games for a lot of reasons. 99% of the time nobody but the developers and perhaps small community interested knows about it.
Also I would like to point out that Valve didn't make a statement. And apparently both developers refuse to directly quote Valve reasoning provided to them - it's almost like developers could shame themselves by proving their games violated some existing policy - of course without knowing the Valve reasoning this couldn't be proven, but so couldn't be "censorship".

Meanwhile GOG made one of the greatest "hold my beer" bad moves while being carefully watched and with evidence being collected.
The Steam behaviour just cannot be compared to GOG's case at all.

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fronzelneekburm: The best part is that the game page shows that the devs put enough effort into this release they even enabled Galaxy achievements.

I sure hope gog compensated them ROYALLY for all this wasted effort.

Everything about this miserable affair pisses me off so much I can't really find the proper words for it...
Considering that you cannot put a product page live nor announce a planned release (especially just few days before planned release) without signing distribution contact before first GOG should be held legally responsible for this whole ordeal by developers / publisher.
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Magnitus: I find that refraining from publishing content degrading a world leader (something that I consider to be of bad taste to begin with... there is unfortunately a lot of it in the media and even when its targeting someone I don't like, like Trump, I find it to be among the basest most shameful kind of discourse someone can have... that people publicly engage in such base discourse with impunity and without any kind of shame speaks volumes about the regression of our culture) at the risk of alienating a 1+ billion user market to be a compromise that I can live with.

If it gets broader than that (ie, "not promoting democracy, not portaying any kind of revolt against dictatorships, etc"), then we'll talk.
A) Devotion didn't make fun of China's Pooh Bear anymore. The one tiny scrap of paper making fun of him was removed from the game already. Although, I hope they put it back when they get the game published with some platform that has some balls and dares to stand for free speech.

B) Any idiotic leader in the world can and should be made fun of. Trump, Pooh Bear, Putin and everyone else, even historic ones like Muhammad and other religious leaders.
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Breja: "Born idealist", huh?
Yes, there are many kinds of ideals, some of them conflicting.

I believe in making an effort to understand one another and trying to minimise conflicts. We know how ugly things can get when we let our baser instincts get the better of us. Human history is filled with such moments.

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Leevi: A) Devotion didn't make fun of China's Pooh Bear anymore. The one tiny scrap of paper making fun of him was removed from the game already. Although, I hope they put it back when they get the game published with some platform that has some balls and dares to stand for free speech.

B) Any idiotic leader in the world can and should be made fun of. Trump, Pooh Bear, Putin and everyone else, even historic ones like Muhammad and other religious leaders.
Not being demeaning to people is not always about them, especially in the case of those who do horrible things.

Its also about you and about those who listen to you.

Also, nobody, no matter how decent they are, has universal popularity. Everyone has detractors. One always hope they can keep a minimum of decorum.
Post edited February 01, 2021 by Magnitus
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Time4Tea: Is anyone else intending to boycott GOG? Who is with me?
While I don't care for that game Devotion and also don't think that censoring is only enforced by China, I'm sympathetic with your cause. Also I see the problems here on gog and am not happy with it. But I doubt that a boycott by a few people in relation to the majority of customers that never or seldom visit gogs forum will bring any change.
Also is censoring already happening here in the forum and especially since last year that should also be a concern. But, as I already wrote I doubt that China is the only major player here. Or since when would China care what political topics some people in a computer game store forum discuss?
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Time4Tea: Is anyone else intending to boycott GOG? Who is with me?
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viperfdl: While I don't care for that game Devotion and also don't think that censoring is only enforced by China, I'm sympathetic with your cause. Also I see the problems here on gog and am not happy with it. But I doubt that a boycott by a few people in relation to the majority of customers that never or seldom visit gogs forum will bring any change.
Also is censoring already happening here in the forum and especially since last year that should also be a concern. But, as I already wrote I doubt that China is the only major player here. Or since when would China care what political topics some people in a computer game store forum discuss?
They do.. *poof* *disappears in white smoke*
Also: Tencent.
Post edited February 01, 2021 by D.Keys