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timppu: I have no idea why some pro-DLC and pro-DRM people get so overly angry that someone would prefer buying the complete editions. It is no different from preferring to buy GOG games with relevant expansion packs included.
Two things... Their mommies forgot to teach them that other opinions existed in the world besides their own or they have a foot in the industry. Either way, their ridiculous rants, insults, and wild speculation about the right and wrong of it don't seem to be swaying anyone, so its probably best to just let them think they won something and keep doing what you enjoy ;)
I'm fine with DLC as long as it adds to the game something that shouldn't be already there.
I'm also fine with day one DLC as long as it's a bonus for Pre-Purchases or Collector's Editions.
See ME3 DLC. A lot people got crazy because it was "Day One DLC. $9,99 for a critical character! Essential to the story!."
Eh... Not really.
I pre-ordered the collector's edition and didn't mind the DLC (it was "free" for me anyway). And Javik (the prothean) wasn't critical at all. I didn't even use him. We just chat back at the Normandy a couple of times.

Borderlands is another good example of how DLC should be handled.
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timppu: I was comparing the prices on the same day (default prices), not 1.5 years apart.
Don't be obtuse, they were introduced 1.5 years apart, you know damned well what that means, and no one buys the older SKU because, duh, there's a GOTY edition. However it remains up for sale because it costs basically nothing to keep it up for sale.

You're comparing the price of a release day game/expac/dlc to the price of the longtail GOTY one, it's apples and oranges. Your GOTY version didn't exist when the first one was put up for sale. Your argument is basically an argument against ever buying anything within the first 4-5 years until it's hit its absolute bottom price, because otherwise "it makes no sense, it'll be cheaper later!" That's not an argument against DLC, it's an argument for paying the least possible price for everything.
Post edited April 20, 2012 by orcishgamer
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FAButzke: I'm fine with DLC as long as it adds to the game something that shouldn't be already there.
I'm also fine with day one DLC as long as it's a bonus for Pre-Purchases or Collector's Editions.
See ME3 DLC. A lot people got crazy because it was "Day One DLC. $9,99 for a critical character! Essential to the story!."
Eh... Not really.
I pre-ordered the collector's edition and didn't mind the DLC (it was "free" for me anyway). And Javik (the prothean) wasn't critical at all. I didn't even use him. We just chat back at the Normandy a couple of times.

Borderlands is another good example of how DLC should be handled.
Yep, I agree with this.

I also don't really have a problem with purely cosmetic little packs. If you don't want them, you aren't missing anything by not buying them.
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FAButzke: I'm fine with DLC as long as it adds to the game something that shouldn't be already there.
I'm also fine with day one DLC as long as it's a bonus for Pre-Purchases or Collector's Editions.
See ME3 DLC. A lot people got crazy because it was "Day One DLC. $9,99 for a critical character! Essential to the story!."
Eh... Not really.
I pre-ordered the collector's edition and didn't mind the DLC (it was "free" for me anyway). And Javik (the prothean) wasn't critical at all. I didn't even use him. We just chat back at the Normandy a couple of times.

Borderlands is another good example of how DLC should be handled.
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Crassmaster: Yep, I agree with this.

I also don't really have a problem with purely cosmetic little packs. If you don't want them, you aren't missing anything by not buying them.
I don't mind cosmetic DLC when there's at least a few free options that don't totally suck. You see FF13 offering free and paid outfits, that's probably a better way to go (I haven't played FF13, I just see their DLC on the marketplace).

Also, cosmetic DLC can be handled very badly, see the EVE Monocle debacle.
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orcishgamer: Also, cosmetic DLC can be handled very badly, see the EVE Monocle debacle.
How come that monocle was so expensive in the first place? Was its price dependent on the demand or was it just put at a very high price point from the get go? If it was the former, then I don't mind, considering how market driven EVE is anyway, and if anything it might be viewed as an interesting experiment in digital value and demand.
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orcishgamer: Also, cosmetic DLC can be handled very badly, see the EVE Monocle debacle.
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AFnord: How come that monocle was so expensive in the first place? Was its price dependent on the demand or was it just put at a very high price point from the get go? If it was the former, then I don't mind, considering how market driven EVE is anyway, and if anything it might be viewed as an interesting experiment in digital value and demand.
It was because they were testing to see if they could get people to pay it. Some did, btw, but they may have determined it wasn't worth insulting the intelligence of the rest of their fanbase in order to sell some 80 dollar monocles (or at least, the fanbase felt that they'd had their intelligences insulted, whether they had been or not).
Two specific DLCs have annoyed me. In DA:O in the camp there's someone who offers a DLC mission, even though I'm RPing a helpful sort my character had to tell the guy to swivel on it because I hadn't bought the DLC. Fallout: NV had something similar, with constant mentions of the other courier, a sideplot that only had an outcome in a DLC.

Looking at those examples i'd say that for me, it's how they're marketed. If they're advertised fairly seperate to the actual game I don't mind them, this allows me to decide whether or not I want to buy them without feeling any ingame repurcussions. but if I see elements of the DLC seeded throughout the game, enticing me to buy it in what might aswell be a giant ingame popup advert then it annoys me, this makes it seem like something has been taken out of the game and held back to try to grab more money from me.
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Cormoran: Two specific DLCs have annoyed me. In DA:O in the camp there's someone who offers a DLC mission, even though I'm RPing a helpful sort my character had to tell the guy to swivel on it because I hadn't bought the DLC. Fallout: NV had something similar, with constant mentions of the other courier, a sideplot that only had an outcome in a DLC.

Looking at those examples i'd say that for me, it's how they're marketed. If they're advertised fairly seperate to the actual game I don't mind them, this allows me to decide whether or not I want to buy them without feeling any ingame repurcussions. but if I see elements of the DLC seeded throughout the game, enticing me to buy it in what might aswell be a giant ingame popup advert then it annoys me, this makes it seem like something has been taken out of the game and held back to try to grab more money from me.
And the reward for doing the Warden's Keep quest dlc was a storage chest something that should have been in the camp in the main game
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Cormoran: Two specific DLCs have annoyed me. In DA:O in the camp there's someone who offers a DLC mission, even though I'm RPing a helpful sort my character had to tell the guy to swivel on it because I hadn't bought the DLC. Fallout: NV had something similar, with constant mentions of the other courier, a sideplot that only had an outcome in a DLC.

Looking at those examples i'd say that for me, it's how they're marketed. If they're advertised fairly seperate to the actual game I don't mind them, this allows me to decide whether or not I want to buy them without feeling any ingame repurcussions. but if I see elements of the DLC seeded throughout the game, enticing me to buy it in what might aswell be a giant ingame popup advert then it annoys me, this makes it seem like something has been taken out of the game and held back to try to grab more money from me.
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Elmofongo: And the reward for doing the Warden's Keep quest dlc was a storage chest something that should have been in the camp in the main game
Totally agreed, I've long bagged on Bioware for Warden's Keep. Horse Armor doesn't seem like much of a sin at all in comparison (give me a wardrobe of horse armor DLCs, just avoid 4th wall breaking crap like Warden's Keep!).
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Elmofongo: And the reward for doing the Warden's Keep quest dlc was a storage chest something that should have been in the camp in the main game
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orcishgamer: Totally agreed, I've long bagged on Bioware for Warden's Keep. Horse Armor doesn't seem like much of a sin at all in comparison (give me a wardrobe of horse armor DLCs, just avoid 4th wall breaking crap like Warden's Keep!).
here is an article of bioware defending the warden's keep dlc it's still bullshit imo:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.154083-Dragon-Age-Designer-Says-DLC-Not-Meant-to-Rip-Off-Players
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orcishgamer: Totally agreed, I've long bagged on Bioware for Warden's Keep. Horse Armor doesn't seem like much of a sin at all in comparison (give me a wardrobe of horse armor DLCs, just avoid 4th wall breaking crap like Warden's Keep!).
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Elmofongo: here is an article of bioware defending the warden's keep dlc it's still bullshit imo:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.154083-Dragon-Age-Designer-Says-DLC-Not-Meant-to-Rip-Off-Players
It is bullshit, but the part about EA having nothing to do with it was likely true. They did keep losing stuff in the vendor's inventory, but the chest at Warden's Keep worked on day 1, that was bullshit as well.

The bullshit wasn't really that it was launch day, it was the inclusion of party stash only as part of the DLC and the 4th wall breaking NPC in your party camp where you have to look at him.
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Elmofongo: here is an article of bioware defending the warden's keep dlc it's still bullshit imo:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.154083-Dragon-Age-Designer-Says-DLC-Not-Meant-to-Rip-Off-Players
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orcishgamer: It is bullshit, but the part about EA having nothing to do with it was likely true. They did keep losing stuff in the vendor's inventory, but the chest at Warden's Keep worked on day 1, that was bullshit as well.

The bullshit wasn't really that it was launch day, it was the inclusion of party stash only as part of the DLC and the 4th wall breaking NPC in your party camp where you have to look at him.
litiraly like you said warden's keep was 10x worse than the horse armor fiasco at least you did not need the horse armor
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FAButzke: I'm also fine with day one DLC as long as it's a bonus for Pre-Purchases or Collector's Editions.
Pre-Order bonusses suck in my eyes - at least when it comes to stuff that can be distributed digitally and especially when it's ingame stuff. It's just a wicked method to get people to buy a game before they can even get any honest opinions about it. Some pre-order offers are over before the first professional reviews come in. Publishers are actually punishing people for being a little cautious or skeptical - in other words having common sense. What the heck? I really don't see any good reason why there should be content exclusive to those people who have a lot of money or are over excited at the right time - not in times when "producing" the content means nothing more than using internet traffic.
I hate micro transactions, pre-order bonuses and chopped up games, but I do like it when the devs provide us with extra content (instead of just focusing on their next project). We don't see enough proper expansions.

Having said that, I am willing to pay more for games with more content (Ithere is nothing like a game such as Skyrim).
Post edited April 30, 2012 by ithilien827