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forbidden5: The vzbv announced that Valve has committed itself to making Steam accessible to those who didn't consent to their EULA changes, supposedly effective tomorrow.
Valve wasn't so forthcoming with the request to enable used sales, obviously, so they've been sued about this again.
Link in German
Does any DD (exept Green Man, and then only with capsule) allow used sale? Does this mean that every digital software seller will get sued?
No clue. For a consumer protection agency, it's probably more efficient to go after the biggest fish first, so they won't have to sue everyone else.
Actually I would be happy about some sort of Steam store based credit system. If you want to sell back the game you get certain amount of credits based on the games current prize and how long you've owned it. That would be a good way to clear my account of all those games I won't be playing again and in turn I could get a new game with those credits.
One of the main benefits of digital sales is avoiding the pawn shop mentality and treating games like hammers. They will never relent on that, I expect, nor should they in my opinion.
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tomimt: Actually I would be happy about some sort of Steam store based credit system. If you want to sell back the game you get certain amount of credits based on the games current prize and how long you've owned it. That would be a good way to clear my account of all those games I won't be playing again and in turn I could get a new game with those credits.
I wouldn't mind having an option to trade old games for old games. It wouldn't have to be converted into credits for newer games. Which could keep new sales going as well as giving people the chance to do used trades?
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amok: Does any DD (exept Green Man, and then only with capsule) allow used sale? Does this mean that every digital software seller will get sued?
Have any of their recently released games (including those tied to capsule) actually support trade in? All I've been seeing of late is "this item cannot be traded in". Granted, they filter out most of their catalog for me so it's possible that's why I haven't seen any recent ones.
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amok: Does any DD (exept Green Man, and then only with capsule) allow used sale? Does this mean that every digital software seller will get sued?
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bansama: Have any of their recently released games (including those tied to capsule) actually support trade in? All I've been seeing of late is "this item cannot be traded in". Granted, they filter out most of their catalog for me so it's possible that's why I haven't seen any recent ones.
I don't actually use GMG, I do not mind lightweight DRM, but for some reason capsule scares me... I think it is due the name. Irrational fears, and so on.

However, I have the feeling they are selling more and more steam keys, which is, off course, non trade-able.
Good that this happened. Rather telling that Valve had to be forced with threat of legal action to offer the same functionality other companies offered from the start, but at least they will now.
I don't necessarily believe that consumers should have the rights to second hand sales of digital games, however I also don't think any storefront should have the right to treat its store as a separate platform (i.e. requiring games to be ran only through their unique client). No store should be able to legally alter game files like that unless the developers designed it that way intentionally (i.e. Steamworks). This is unrealistic, but how shitty would it be if buying a game from a brick and mortar store required that you be in that store in order to play your game, lol.

But, if Steam did have to allow second hand sales, or at least some type of trade in deal, I can't say that I wouldn't be at least a little bit pleased. Probably half of my Steam titles are games that I bought impulsively during sales, thinking that I'd want to play them later on. Well, later on came and went, and those games I am no long interested in playing. As an example, the Dawn of War franchise. Dawn of War is cool as hell, so I figured I'd check them out. Before I even got a chance to play them, I realized that I no longer enjoyed RTS's. Actually, I can't stand RTS's now. Not really sure what caused that to change, but I definitely prefer turn-based. I wish that were the only example, but I have about 200 more =/

The blow is softened of course by the fact that I picked most of them up dirt cheap during sales, but still, cheap x 200+ ain't exactly nothin'. They were anywhere from probably $3 something to $30, so I'm sure it's still $1000+ worth of software I'll never use. Would be nice to have options.

And just in case anyone feels like chiming in with something like "You shouldn't have bought them, stupid idiot shit!" A) At the time, I wasn't expecting my tastes in gaming to change so drastically; and B) If I had overpurchased on literally just about any other good in the world, I'd be able to return or at least resell those prodcuts. And keep in mind -- I'm not saying I think Steam is obligated to make this change, only that I wouldn't mind if they did.
If Steam ever allows trade-ins or selling, i.d take.0.50.each for the 200 or.so,titles.i'll never play.
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StingingVelvet: One of the main benefits of digital sales is avoiding the pawn shop mentality and treating games like hammers. They will never relent on that, I expect, nor should they in my opinion.
Avoiding that seems to have devalued games on PC, though. It's not like being 5-10 bucks 3 months after launch is any worse than people trading your games second hand. I think it's encouraged PC gamers to by and large rarely buy on release day.
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anjohl: If Steam ever allows trade-ins or selling, i.d take.0.50.each for the 200 or.so,titles.i'll never play.
Yeah I mean, anything would be better than nothing.

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orcishgamer: Avoiding that seems to have devalued games on PC, though. It's not like being 5-10 bucks 3 months after launch is any worse than people trading your games second hand. I think it's encouraged PC gamers to by and large rarely buy on release day.
I hadn't considered that, but that could very well be true.
Lol, of course the lack of a secondary market kills the value of the product! Anyone who did economics 101 can tell you that. Used sales subsidize new sales, bottom line.

And to the people in the thread that are saying they don't think people should have the right to sell their games, what the fuck is wrong with you? Do you own shares in Valve? There is NO defensible position from that angle.
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StingingVelvet: One of the main benefits of digital sales is avoiding the pawn shop mentality and treating games like hammers. They will never relent on that, I expect, nor should they in my opinion.
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orcishgamer: Avoiding that seems to have devalued games on PC, though. It's not like being 5-10 bucks 3 months after launch is any worse than people trading your games second hand. I think it's encouraged PC gamers to by and large rarely buy on release day.
The thing is though, most games aren't worth 60 bucks. No matter what their making cost were. This, of course, largely depends on a person, but games are vastly over prized.
Silly semantics some use in this thread.

When i purchase a game or other software, i purchase a "Usage License". This grants ownership of a finite thing. One License To Play. Of course i don't own the rights to a game. But i absolutely Do Own a license to play it. So yes, we do indeed own the games we buy.

The reason i will not purchase Any product requiring steamworks, is that acceptance of the steamworks EULA grants valve ownership of MY Usage License. Worse is that steamworks has contrived a method which can actually enforce their ridiculous EULA. They can prevent me from using the product i paid for. They can do this for whatever reason they deem appropriate. That is unacceptable to me.


On the topic of used game sales: i'm of the mind that i should be able to sell usage licenses, thereby transferring ownership of it to someone else. i would no longer own the license, and so could no longer use the product. Simple. i don't get the drama around this. Though i do rather like the idea of a small percentage of sales going back to the rights holder at every point of sale, from initial sale through second hand sales. But i'm not so keen on it for the gaming industry, due to the way the publishers have been doing business.