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ssokolow: Hope for the best, plan for the worst, and believe whatever it takes to keep fighting.
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JaqFrost: Very true. I'm inclined to agree with WizardStan above; GOG seems to have changed their entire gameplan a good while back and the more I see of the new and improved GOG, the more I realize that it just isn't for me. Sadly, there aren't many options of where to get games if you want them DRM-free, so I'm still clinging on. =/
There is still the HumbleStore and Desura.
Although both are Steam infected, you can still see which game is DRM free and free from Steam.
It's sad to see how this shop develops and I wish I'd been here earlier.
Post edited December 30, 2014 by Klumpen0815
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Klumpen0815: There is still the HumbleStore and Desura.
Although both are Steam infected, you can still see which game is DRM free and free from Steam.
It's sad to see how this shop develops and I wish I'd been here earlier.
FireFlowerGames is DRM-free, but it's a tiny store and I don't like getting charged in EUR. I've never bought from DotEmu, but aren't they DRM-free too...? I quite liked ShinyLoot -- support over there was really helpful -- but they don't seem to be adding new DRM-free games, just Steam.
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Klumpen0815: There is still the HumbleStore and Desura.
Although both are Steam infected, you can still see which game is DRM free and free from Steam.
It's sad to see how this shop develops and I wish I'd been here earlier.
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JaqFrost: FireFlowerGames is DRM-free, but it's a tiny store and I don't like getting charged in EUR. I've never bought from DotEmu, but aren't they DRM-free too...? I quite liked ShinyLoot -- support over there was really helpful -- but they don't seem to be adding new DRM-free games, just Steam.
If it helps, the stores my DRM-free collection spans are GOG, Humble, Desura, IndieGameStand, DotEmu, ShinyLoot, Gameolith, FireFlower Games, and the Groupees bundles where Groupees directly hosts the DRM-free downloads.

As for ShinyLoot, only a few months ago, they announced some kind of guarantee that they'd limit how far the proportion of DRMed games could grow. (I believe it was that the percentage of games that were DRM-free or offline-only CD-key activated couldn't drop below 85%)
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JaqFrost: Very true. I'm inclined to agree with WizardStan above; GOG seems to have changed their entire gameplan a good while back and the more I see of the new and improved GOG, the more I realize that it just isn't for me. Sadly, there aren't many options of where to get games if you want them DRM-free, so I'm still clinging on. =/
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Klumpen0815: There is still the HumbleStore and Desura.
Although both are Steam infected, you can still see which game is DRM free and free from Steam.
It's sad to see how this shop develops and I wish I'd been here earlier.
I forget what other examples I've seen, but it feels like businesses enjoy waiting until the Christmas holidays to gift you turds. (Probably because they're not there to get flamed in real time and they hope the feasting and gifting and family will distract you and take the edge off any anger you do feel if you happen to still be paying attention.)
Post edited December 30, 2014 by ssokolow
My two cents:

This is the same company that configures games to run in administrator mode on Windows by default, even when there is demonstrably no technical reason to do so (e.g. Steam and Humble equivalents run fine with standard privileges). Throwing the baby out with the bath water for the sake of dodging a bunch of support requests from bozos isn't exactly uncharted territory for GOG is what I'm saying.

I personally really like the way Humble handles this: provide the Steam key for ease of use, and let the devs who want to supply a DRM-free version do so in any way they like, which is often a simple, clean ZIP file. No counterintuitive version numbers, no patching snafus, just a file, a timestamp, and a MD5 checksum. Of course, Humble's DRM-free catalog is orders of magnitude worse than GOG's, so that's not much of a consolation.

I never trusted or liked GOG's meddling with game distributions, if for nothing else than for aesthetic reasons (I don't want their God damn branding everywhere). You'd think that with Galaxy impending, the regular downloads on GOG could become cleaner and more power-user-friendly, but here we are.
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just my 2 cents, but it might be better to not concentrate too much on the "GoG adds evil DRM" part.
As seen in this thread (and in hundreds of internet discussions before), we will just get lost in pointless arguments about the semantic subtleties of the term "DRM". Better stick to the actual technical facts and maybe we can avoid an emotionally and ideologically charged "war of words". ;)
ssokolow has posted a nice list earlier iirc, which I think provided a good basis (uh, though I can't find it right now)
let's see:

- browsers who automatically treat the bin files as RAR archives(via content-sniffing), can be avoided with the right HTTP headers( see and [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/on_gnulinux_has_anyone_be_able_to_extract_the_rar_innosetup_installers/post219]here)
- choosing a unique filename ending instead of .bin would avoid the automatic association with VLC (and the attempted playback as a video file)
- preventing the spreading of modified gog installers is a nonsense argument: a) people who download illegal versions don't care about the digital signature b) malware authors are clever enough to circumvent the password protection c) illegal users don't deserve more consideration than legitimate buyers
- many games can be played without the need for a Windows environment(dosbox, ScummVM, etc), which makes the possibility to extract the installer instead of running it under windows a very desirable feature.
- while running under wine is not supported, there seem to be quite a lot of linux users here (see the wishlist item for more linux support). Hindering those users on purpose without a real technical justification goes against the mutual respect between GoG and its users, which (in my mind) is also one of the core principles of GoG. Listening to the wishes of the userbase has worked in the past, let's not abandon it.
- we are totally fine with the fact that we only get support when running the game in the environment listed on the game page
- adding restrictions on how the users has to use the game goes against the spirit of what GoG stands for. Even if the intended purpose of minimizing potential user problems seems legit.
- since currently the new installers don't work under wine, this makes getting a pirated (older) version more attractive

forgot anything?
Post edited December 30, 2014 by immi101
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immi101: just my 2 cents, but it might be better to not concentrate too much on the "GoG adds evil DRM" part.
As seen in this thread (and in hundreds of internet discussions before), we will just get lost in pointless arguments about the semantic subtleties of the term "DRM". Better stick to the actual technical facts and maybe we can avoid an emotionally and ideologically charged "war of words". ;)
Exactly, basically it can be reduced to "GoG made a technical decision, some users disagree with this decision because it cause some extra inconvenience to them, they are free to ask, politely if possible, for GoG to change their decision or at least alter it to make it move convenient for them" that's all, and IMHO that's probably the most productive thing to do if you are impacted by it.

No need to immediately switch to full hysteria mode declaring that GoG betrayed humanity or that tomorrow they will add always online DNA check DRM on all their games, I doubt it's really doing to help and if anything it might make the "blues" less likely to want to participate in such a thread.
Just want to raise my voice too: gog.com, this was a misstep beyond the DRM-line, even if well motivated and (currently!) workaround-able. (Voted, too)

But, I'm positive that you will find your way back on the path, like you did before :)
Post edited December 30, 2014 by shaddim
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BlackBox7: This is the same company that configures games to run in administrator mode on Windows by default, even when there is demonstrably no technical reason to do so (e.g. Steam and Humble equivalents run fine with standard privileges). Throwing the baby out with the bath water for the sake of dodging a bunch of support requests from bozos isn't exactly uncharted territory for GOG is what I'm saying.
Good point. Essentially one of the variations on Hanlon's razor.

Thanks for reminding me.
Post edited December 30, 2014 by ssokolow
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BlackBox7: This is the same company that configures games to run in administrator mode on Windows by default, even when there is demonstrably no technical reason to do so (e.g. Steam and Humble equivalents run fine with standard privileges). Throwing the baby out with the bath water for the sake of dodging a bunch of support requests from bozos isn't exactly uncharted territory for GOG is what I'm saying.
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ssokolow: Good point. Essentially one of the variations on Hanlon's razor.

Thanks for reminding me.
Exactly.

I don't really work in the tech sector, but I need to do basic tech support here and there, and I can't tell you how many times I've had to come up with an awful kludge of a solution to appease the external demands of a situation. Classic example: "Hey, set my 1024x768 LCD monitor back to 640x480 resolution because I want my icons BIG." So you grit your teeth and do the thing you need to do, even though in the back of your mind you're like SHIT SHIT SHIT.

I can imagine Gowor finds himself in just such a situation more often than he'd like. But he's obviously smart, and he's gotta be a perfectionist nerd like us, so I have to back immi101's suggestion to keep that in mind, and frame this as a mutually beneficial technical discussion. It'll be an easier sell for everyone involved. I mean, I want my dream world of zipped resource files and open source engine implementations as much as the next guy, but we can only get there a step at a time.

EDIT: Of course, we always have raising a stink as a plan B option, just in case, heh.
Post edited December 30, 2014 by BlackBox7
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Gowor: Another reason - I want to avoid the situation where someone tampers with the archives (let's say adding malware, or some illegal content), and uploads the modified version on torrents. I don't want the GOG Installer installing anything else than it was supposed to, and it doesn't matter how it was obtained.
I actually don't care if GOG files on torrents get tampered with. Since GOG has been DRM free, nobody should be torrenting any GOG files.

The recent trend of changes is worrying me; Galaxy, the new and dull gray tiled web site, and now the changes to the installer.
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BlackBox7: I mean, I want my dream world of zipped resource files and open source engine implementations as much as the next guy, but we can only get there a step at a time.
Not if we are taking steps backwards.
Post edited December 30, 2014 by jalister
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BlackBox7: I mean, I want my dream world of zipped resource files and open source engine implementations as much as the next guy, but we can only get there a step at a time.
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jalister: Not if we are taking steps backwards.
Point taken. I acknowledged that I may have been a little too mellow in an edit to my post.
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Wow

When I left this thread, my last words were that I'll try to get "Wine mode" nogui switch working again, and one paragraph before - that I'm open to ideas that could be implemented. Thanks for some by the way.

After partially debugging the Wine fix, I returned to this thread, and noticed that it escalated quite a bit overnight.
While I'm open to ideas (and I implemented some requested changes before, like the way Foxit is installed), I'm only a programmer, not a PR person. I'm afraid in this situation I cannot continue this discussion. Sorry, it doesn't mean I don't care about this issue, but I’m here to write code and I wouldn’t like to be misunderstood.
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Gowor: I'm only a programmer, not a PR person. I'm afraid in this situation I cannot continue this discussion. Sorry, it doesn't mean I don't care about this issue, but I’m here to write code and I wouldn’t like to be misunderstood.
Well Gowor, it might be time to get your PR team involved then.

I can safely say that if this "encrypted installer" continues I will have no reason to use GOG. A pity, I stuck with this site for a while, even bought some older games during the sale - and they're Windows games, which work well in Wine as they're old.

And now I'm locked out of my purchase and contemplating a refund.
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jalister: The recent trend of changes is worrying me; Galaxy, the new and dull gray tiled web site, and now the changes to the installer.
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Benanov: I can safely say that if this "encrypted installer" continues I will have no reason to use GOG. A pity, I stuck with this site for a while, even bought some older games during the sale - and they're Windows games, which work well in Wine as they're old.

And now I'm locked out of my purchase [...]
You and thousands of others, dudes.
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BlackBox7: I mean, I want my dream world of zipped resource files and open source engine implementations as much as the next guy, but we can only get there a step at a time.
One can dream.
No more installers and freedom about how to handle what you bought - what a pleasant thought.
Post edited December 30, 2014 by Klumpen0815
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BlackBox7: I mean, I want my dream world of zipped resource files and open source engine implementations as much as the next guy, but we can only get there a step at a time.
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Klumpen0815: One can dream.
No more installers and freedom about how to handle what you bought - what a pleasant thought.
It's too bad that Windows users aren't used to something like the GOG Linux tarballs. I really like that "tarball, start.sh, and optional `start.sh --install` and `start.sh --uninstall` approach."
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Gowor: Wow

When I left this thread, my last words were that I'll try to get "Wine mode" nogui switch working again, and one paragraph before - that I'm open to ideas that could be implemented. Thanks for some by the way.

After partially debugging the Wine fix, I returned to this thread, and noticed that it escalated quite a bit overnight.
While I'm open to ideas (and I implemented some requested changes before, like the way Foxit is installed), I'm only a programmer, not a PR person. I'm afraid in this situation I cannot continue this discussion. Sorry, it doesn't mean I don't care about this issue, but I’m here to write code and I wouldn’t like to be misunderstood.
Regarding any of the suggestions that I made, glad I could help.

As for the risk of misunderstanding, don't worry. Fear of being misunderstood has been a defining influence on my personality so I may understand your concerns better than you do.

However, I will have to agree with Benanov that this is a serious issue with my continued patronage, so please let the PR team know that they're needed A.S.A.P.

(By "continued patronage", I mean that I currently own over 60% of GOG's catalog through GOG, almost an additional 10% as games I own elsewhere and have been slowly re-buying here as a show of support since Linux support was added, and that GOG is the only place where I've seriously considered trying to collect the entire catalog just for the sake of it.)
Post edited December 30, 2014 by ssokolow