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gogtrial34987: That the scum players very likely are divided over the houses, so successfully lynching a scum would give town-leans to the other two players from the same house.
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Vitek: You are aware mafia could be lying and they are in fact not from those houses they'll claim they are from, right?
Mafia is by definition from no house at all, so they must be lying. The distribution of houses after the mass-claim will help point them out.

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gogtrial34987: Possible scenario: scum have a rolecop, which has found a cop. If said cop is pushed to L-1, he'll claim, and has a high chance of being protected by a doctor at night, meaning scum can't safely NK him. Hence, scum would want to stay away from voting this cop, and that's something which that scum rolecop would want to tell his buddies about. There's other similar scenario's as well. I can't think of any way for us to know if any such scenario's would or wouldn't make sense in the current situation. Can you?
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phaolo: Are cops, rolecops and doctors frequent in Mafia?
This seems a bit overthinking.. and it still doesn't apply to the current situation, since nobody claimed any role or was even at L-3 in this day.
On gog? Yes. Our mods tend to prefer games with lots of roles.
I'm not at all saying this is what's happening. I'm clarifying my answer to the question you asked in #498 about why scum might want to breadcrumb. The scenario I presented specifically talks about the desire of scum to prevent a claim from happening as the reason why they'd want to communicate among themselves before the next night.

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Lifthrasil: Slytherin aren't always evil in the books. Well, not all of them at least. Some actually fight against Voldemort.
Bleh. Well, that's dedo out of my town-core and back into the null-zone.
Has nmillar stated knowledge about the books at any point? Does his town-read of dedo still make sense, given this?
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phaolo: Please, avoid quoting huge posts (to just add a single line), it's already difficult to follow the thread as it is..
+1

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gogtrial34987: Mafia is by definition from no house at all, so they must be lying. The distribution of houses after the mass-claim will help point them out.
Oh, you meant they lied and spread themselves across the houses! I misunderstood you and thought you are believe there is mafia in various houses.
It works with the assumption houses are evenly distributed and we don't know if that's the case.
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blotunga: I was skimming the posts and for some reason got the impression that it was nmillar who was against it, might've been someone else. You read too much into it.
The thing is: no one other than yourself expressed being against it before #492, which is why I asked you to point out which specific post you misinterpreted.

Your entire post doesn't make sense to me.

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GymHenson: That said, if I am doing that well this game then that is a bonus to my birthday celebrations. :)
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blotunga: Quite ok, though I agree with nmillar that town normally should oppose such early claims. Or so I think.
Oh god. I just thought of an explanation which fits. Are you, GH and nmillar the scum team? Was this meant for your private daychat and accidentally posted in the forum? Oh man, that'd suck, but now I can't unsee it...
Fuck there is so much to catch up and I'm still near #500.
Yeah, I was considering voting you anyway, but this is just... *shakes head*

votus blotunga
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Lifthrasil: Just saw this upon re-reading. Yep. That's exactly what dedo and I would probably do if we ever were scum together. But unfortunately we aren't, so I can only speculate about his alignment.
Is it? I'll know for when it happens :) But that reminds me - @gogtrial, when you got all paranoid you said you were going to re-read our interactions to look for this. How did that come out?

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gogtrial34987: We have trent's reads as known-town reads. He had everyone (but me) as "Meh, I have no idea", with only a "little tingle" on nmillar ( #224).
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Microfish_1: You LAMIST! You WIFOM! /s /jk :-D
(sorry, I couldn't resist as no-one else had said it yet.)
Lift did, of course, but that's what he does, so yeah, thanks!

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GymHenson: If that's not good enough, note that I have some suspicions based on Lift's hammer on D1.
Are your suspicions of Lift based solely on his hammer?


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Vitek: With it, as the argument between them came to halt, so did my attention toward it.
At the time of writing this line my stance on the matter remains unchanged. Lift is still my top pick at this very moment but I have 2.5 50 posts pages to go through.


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Lifthrasil: I did. It would be very stupid. If you assume that the hammer was intentional, you automatically assume that I knew that trent was at L-1. Knowing that, this close to a deadline with zero chance of another wagon forming before the deadline, any scum worth his salt would wait. Or pretend not to be there. Trent was a goner anyhow so all scum had to do was wait for Town to hammer (which I did) - and even if none of us would have hammered, it would have ended in a no-lynch and Scum would have rejoiced even more. So, if I were Scum, hammering in such an unnecessary way, thereby drawing attention, would be very stupid indeed.

That does not make me Town, however. Since scum!me could make the same mistake I did: not refreshing before hitting send. That happens easily on mobile. So no, this 'this would be stupid as scum' does not make me Town. However, that you choose to see it as scummy instead of stupid is interesting. But it is not atypical of you.
I agree. It makes no sense for this to have been an intentional "accidental" scum quick-hammer. That doesn't mean it wasn't a scum hammer, just that it was almost certainly an accident and people shouldn't put too much weight on it. Lift is still likely scum :)

Unfortunately the final bit also rings true - GH's musings in this case are quite GH-y. If it was someone else it would have looked worse.


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GymHenson: Could be town!Lift scum hunting, or scum!lift distancing from fellow scum.
Isn't there another possibility here?


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gogtrial34987: Anyone up for a House-only mass-claim, to see where we end up at?
I don't mind that as it's flavor and ZFR explicitly stated flavor means nothing so not sure what it's going to bring but it won't hurt either. Also, the rules allow it.


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GymHenson: To all players, two questions: What do y'all think of NMillar's bringing up of their house in the post I just now replied to, and about their musings on house? Seem suspicious or no?
It's either true and he noticed something familiar or it's false and he noticed something that looks like a nice little thing to attach to early on in the hopes to benefit from it.


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blotunga: I think it's too soon and may actually give scum hints than help town. So nope, I don't think it's a good idea.
Right.


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GymHenson: either they NK me and draw attention to themselves re: my suspects list, or they let me live and I possibly hone in more on them and pick them off, one by one.
Bold.

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GymHenson: As phalo said, it'd be better for a potential cop to out scum!me (if I were scum) and get me out of the game.
It won't be better at all. In a 2-scum game it's a decent consideration to trade 1:1 but if a Cop has identified scum N1 they should try and get them exposed somehow without giving up their role straight away. Otherwise they are likely dead/blocked on the next night and can't look for the other scum.


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phaolo: Microfish vaguely pointing it out doesn't accomplish anything good IMO.
It would be better to stay silent until he's sure about the message and only then report it.
Agreed.


No more time for now. Will continue later on (I realize some or all of the above may be worthless by the time of posting this but you have written a lot and I don't have enough time to go through everything on one go).
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Lifthrasil: Just saw this upon re-reading. Yep. That's exactly what dedo and I would probably do if we ever were scum together. But unfortunately we aren't, so I can only speculate about his alignment.
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dedoporno: Is it? I'll know for when it happens :) But that reminds me - @gogtrial, when you got all paranoid you said you were going to re-read our interactions to look for this. How did that come out?
Nothing there which felt particularly faked, but also nothing which felt unfakeable, so it remains a paranoid worry in the back of my mind, along with all the others. :)

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blotunga: I think it's too soon and may actually give scum hints than help town. So nope, I don't think it's a good idea.
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dedoporno: Right.
What do you mean by that?
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gogtrial34987: What do you mean by that?
Sarcasm. It's supposed to sound like this. I was in a hurry and wasn't able to make it clear. Sorry. I meant that I don't like the tone of this line. Sounds like someone is a bit worried what may come out of this and rather not have the claim going.
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Microfish_1: I don't care for GH's saying that NL is better than L. He is definitely playing differently from usual, and the last time I remember him being "different from usual" he was scum. Now, he claims that this is due to him trying to be better, and is NAI. If true, good on him. If false, shame on us.
Where have ya been? I've said it in several past games, and it has been my primary stance on the matter for awhile now.
(i.e. nolynch is often preferable to me over a possible mislynch)

Of course, I now believe a bit more that the wagon analysis by town veterans might also be helpful as well....so I sort of support both stances(though I prefer mine a bit more), which (as said before in prior posts, and as you can see in prior posts) sort of mentally conflicts in my head a bit.....leading to sometimes conflicting replies by me on the matter.

As for the "better" play(as said before in prior posts): I have tried to be a bit less lazy, buckled down and took more notes, etc....as it's my birthday month and I wanted to make some more effort for this game.

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Microfish_1: I actually find it hard to believe that you haven't noticed this otDay / toNight thing before, as I seem to recall you have used it yourself in previous games. Maybe I misrecall.
I mentioned it, in part, because:

Some accused me of tunneling, and I worry that maybe I might be a bit, so i'm trying to focus on others as well to find scum(though I still hold my current suspects list as is atm, unless something changes it).

And that would include picking at anything that seems suspicious that I can find...including stuff posted by yourself(until and unless you get proven verified town somehow), of course. :)

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Microfish_1: The reason I spelled Holmes backwards is in case the character is under copyright yet. Also to differentiate this from the real persona. You will also notice that i similarly messed up Gregson & Lestrade to form "gregstrade". Also, as this is occurring 2 generations after Holmes, I figured the oral tradition could have gotten things mixed up slightly....
All in all, more of the joke, nothing else.
Thanks for explaining it....btw, what about copyright? Do you really think the IP holders search GOG forum mafia games or mafia games in general? o.0 ;D

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Microfish_1: Are you voting nmillar because you think he scum or to break up a 3-way tie with yourself as one of the other leading wagons?
Wait, are you seriously asking this? o.0

I ask as i've been pretty vocal about my building suspicion of Nmillar(and also Lift and Catte to lesser extents) for the past several pages.

And seeing as I won't vote myself(I like playing, ya see), and Lift is lower on my list, I decided to vote Nmillar, who has been on the top for a few (IRL) days now.

Speaking of NMIllar: If they get within lynch range or so I would unvote them to make sure they can claim if need be.......though if their claim didn't sound genuine enough i'd likely hammer myself after said claim at some point**.

(**=Again, if said claim didn't seem to hold up)

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Microfish_1: Eh... IRL intervened. This is what you get and I'm not thinking clearly now, so I need to go do something else for a few hours. Maybe even sleep before sun-up.
Get some sleep...sleep is good. :)
(I went without sleep for more hours the past few days as it's b-day week and I wanted to enjoy as much of it awake as possible...leading to me falling asleep at my desk a few times, among other things o.0)

(Bump Needed)
Vote Count

blotunga 2 - Lift, gogtrial
nmillar 1 - GH
GH 1 - nmillar


Not voting - catte, phaolo, Micro, dedo, Vitek, blotunga

blotunga is closest at L-4

10 players. Takes 6 to lynch.

When you see a vote count, please make sure your name is against the correct person. Let me know if it isn't.

Not sure I've given the exact time Day will end. It's Friday 8pm UTC. That's 9pm UK, 10pm Central Europe, 4pm East Coast.
It might be a bit later depending on my availability, but not earlier.

About 31hrs left.
Thanks OP
+++++++++++++++++++++++++

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Lifthrasil: I really should start notes again. I didn't do that so far due to lack of time, but they really help!
A player like you isn't taking notes? Really? Was this a joke or are you really not bothering to take notes?

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Lifthrasil: Which only shows that you can reply to your own question 'in what world would Scum be happy about a no-lynch'. So why ask such a question? You know the answer perfectly well.
I sometimes don't say the right words I mean, and people need to "get" the actual meaning (im bad with saying what I mean in general sometimes).

I don't believe I said those exact words(maybe I did, would have to look back)....that aside: what I said/meant was that scum would likely sometimes prefer 2 removed town (mislynch) over a NL.

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Lifthrasil: Interesting question! Especially since nmillar looks less scummy Today than they did Yesterday. Then again, GH already stated before that nmillar was his top suspect after me. So it's not too unusual to switch to his second top favourite if his read of me changes.
Wrong, good sir! :)

I stated(or inferred) that NMillar and Catte were on the top of the list(atm and at that time), and you were below them....though you have since moved to tie with Catte due to a few things you've said(and also gut hunches of mine).

+++

Btw to Lift and all, my current list in order of suspicion:

1. Nmillar
v
v
2. Catte/Lift (tied)

+++

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Lifthrasil: By word of Mod. Did you really miss that? Reading mod messages should be quite high on the priority list! Especially since you even quote the very message in which ZFR stated that houses aren't pure fluff!

Your investment and attention seem to be very low. Why is that?
Funny thing you mention this....Vitek was the only one to reply to that weird (to me) post I noticed between posts 81-100 that I alluded to earlier in the game.

And guess who made the weird (to me) post back then? NMillar

(Of course, could be nothing, but I figure I might as well start laying more of my cards [minor suspicions as well] on the table just in case I somehow [NK/etc] don't make it to D3)

(Bump Please)
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gogtrial34987: I can't rhyme "In what world does that make a lick of sense?" with your new position that "scum sometimes might prefer mislynch over nolynch"
As said to others: sometimes due to lax note taking and poor memory I conflict with what I said before.

Add to that my conflicting support(in my mind, re: my stances on how to play) of "sometimes nolynch is good for town" vs "town should have a wagon to analyze", and you can likely see why some of my posts would conflict or seem to.

(Of course that's fwiw...if you suspect me and want to vote me even at some point that's fine with me)

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gogtrial34987: When you voted and warned others not to hammer, do you remember actually (back then) hoping for Trent to say something that'd result in another lynch? Or was this an after the fact rationale/narrative which you came up with when you were writing #443?
Tbh I forget a bit of the details, but I believe I was hoping Trent would convince others to jump to one of my preferred wagons.

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gogtrial34987: You also didn't answer my additional question from #519:
I was tired when replying(was up late) so didn't know how best to answer that at the time, and due to sleepy brain also couldn't figure out what you were asking somewhat....so I skipped it.

+++++

For future reference to you all others: I skip parts of posts sometimes, even questions made to me, if I cannot figure out what that other player means/wants to know.
(and sometimes if I just want to save time and keep posts short)

(Done to post 566 for now: If anyone replied to me after that I will take care of such AFTER I get back from some errands and such IRL)
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phaolo: Please, avoid quoting huge posts (to just add a single line), it's already difficult to follow the thread as it is..
Sorry about that, was on the phone.
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gogtrial34987: Oh god. I just thought of an explanation which fits. Are you, GH and nmillar the scum team? Was this meant for your private daychat and accidentally posted in the forum? Oh man, that'd suck, but now I can't unsee it...
Lynch me and you'll find out. Come on, you're still interpreting things that aren't there. I'm town.
I think it was this quote, which I mistook for a post as it was a convoluted conversation and was reading on the phone. As said skimming. So it stuck somehow to me.
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nmillar: @Gogtrial: I feel house is irrelevant fluff.
I'm sorry you have fixated yourself on this because it leads nowhere. Or maybe you are scum and you know fully that it leads nowhere and just want to get an easier mis-lynch because I wasn't completely paying attention?
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blotunga: .
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nmillar: @Gogtrial: I feel house is irrelevant fluff.
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blotunga:
I never said this. That's not a true quote.
A bit more catching up.