The above summation pretty much nails my experience. I love trivia so I showed up, more out of curiosity than anything. I tossed out a guess or two and then got caught up in the competition. As soon as I replied to receiving the win, my next thoughts were what’s quoted in the bold portion…except I would replace “Hmmmm” with “Crap” It took the fun out of winning a bit too soon. Live and learn.

This I don't see as WIFOM. If you re-read my post(s) you'll see that I'm lobbying for exactly that - paying attention to how winners act, what they say and potentially the results of their abilities when they claim they have used it. I condemn the the prologue of that whole situation as WIFOM - the part about who would have been more likely to participate in the first place or not, what they reasons were and so on, giving credit to people or taking it away. To me that's as WIFOM as it gets.

This again? I'm baffled at why do you continue to put words in my mouth. I don't have you as scum (nor town for that matter), but every time you repeat this it chips a small piece of that neutral look you have in my eyes. I have never claimed I made a mistake or that it was linguistics issue, or because English is not my native language or whatever else. I have been saying what I did was no accident all along. Others suggested the opposite and I told them they are wrong. Do you believe that I am so dense to pass up on such a good opportunity to cover up my mistake if I made one, especially when others were there to back me up? Thing is that I'm kind of OK with the way you came at me for that potential slip. That's a normal and a good reaction for a townie that doesn't know better and tries to work with whatever they have. My problem is your persistent stating that I said and did something I didn't and it can be seen simply by going back and having a look. I'm really not sure what to think of that.

What puzzles me here is your wording. One word in particular and how did you came up with it. Can you guess what word I'm referring to?

I think so far, if I were to vote, my vote is siding more with Hijack. He seems to be a lot more confrontational with people he thinks are Scum, or Town he is trying to make look like Scum. I do wonder if he is Town, using his past experience to set about finding Scum, or if he is Scum trying to start a wagon against someone from the Town. If he is Town, why not share some of his secret plan/agenda, rather than try to do it all alone? Perhaps sharing it would give Scum the advantage, maybe that is why, in which case it is best left hidden, but perhaps this agenda has a more Scummy tone to it. What do some of the more veteran Town player think? You have played with Hijack more than I have, is this how he normally plays? Should I just put much of this down to his play style, or is the fact he seems to keep lots of details to himself something I should keep an eye on?


I ask him why he thinks I am suspicious, to which he simply replies:

Meanwhile Hyper mentions to adaliabooks that he thinks I am posting often but not really talking much about the game, posting just enough to not been seen as a lurker.

It seems strange that Hyper would go in to a bit of detail, yet Hijack would not (what are these many thing?), despite the fact I asked him to tell me why. With Hyper's comment, people (Town) can then go back and read my posts and see if what he says makes sense to them, but Hijack gave no information other than "mostly because of the tone". How is it helping Town if he continues to hold things back to himself and just gives vague hints or comments? Would it not be more helpful to Town to explain what is is about me you don't trust, so that I can perhaps try to reassure people I am Town, or that the other Town members can re-read my posts using your opinion to see if they agree and then they can try to decide if I am Scum or Town.


To be honest, I have not really mentioned much because I am unsure what to think about much of it. Most of the facts people are voting over do not seem big enough to point someone out as Scum (at least to me), and some things that I did think have already been said. I saw no real reason to comment when I myself am not sure yet, and when others have said some the same things I was thinking. True I have been posting often and not shared much, but much of that was me trying to get a better understanding of the game. I have been watching and reading the exchanges between the more veteran players to try to get a better understanding of the thinks to look out for. You mention that you have followed a few Mafia games before, I have not, this is completely new to me.

Unfortunately, yes. This is exactly how HijacK has played in the past.

I did somewhat agree with Hyper's thoughts on you, but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt because your new. At least your around and posting, which (should) mean you're reading the thread.

My problem is, we've got a lot of new players whose play style is unknown and whose actions can be written off as uncertainty or lack of confidence, and we've got a lot of veterans whose play styles are somewhat anti-town (I'm looking at you, JMich, CSPVG, Robb and Hijack) but doesn't necessarily mean they are scum. So we've got a whole bunch of players with excuses for behaving scummy, ranging from they don't know any better to that's how they always play.

I'm at a lose. My vote stays with JMich for now, but I can see no one else is particularly interested in him as a target right now so will probably move it.

I think the two events we have to go on right now are the win condition controversy, and dedo's 'plan'. I'm not sure there is much to be gained from the win condition thing, and there are too many sides involved to pick someone worth lynching (and I'm not just saying that because I am one of the involved parties).

However I do think that between dedo and RWarehall we could find a consensus to lynch. There is no guarantee either of them is scum, but there is at least a chance that one is, and at the very least the wagon could be analysed to see who voted or who stayed off and might give us more info.

The question is is such a lynch, planned and considered now but without much info, any better than a rushed lynch before the deadline hits? Would one provide more info than the other?

I will blame my English and inability to adequately communicate what I'm trying to say (as evident from the other part of your post that started this), even though I'm starting to wonder a bit if you're deliberately refusing to see what I'm saying; I will try to make it as plain as possible.

I know that your question was about the bolded part only ("once all anti town factions are gone"); in my reply to your question "Do you know the missing word?" I both answered it and took it a bit farther regarding the win-condition in my PM.

The part I bolded in my last reply to you is the answer to your question - I said that the article is missing in what was stated, i.e. not only an article but the definitive one. If you're town (which I lean towards to) and your win-condition is identical to mine in your PM, you should know that none of the other missing words is an article, definitive or indefinite.
I can also tell you that what was stated ("once all anti town factions are gone") differs from the win-condition in my PM in one more point, as it does from the OP, turning one word (anti-town) into two separate words.

If you still think that I brushed your question off, there's really nth else or more I can say about this.


I'm having a hard time with the game and with how flub set up things, there's a lot I don't understand or/ and puzzles me. I am asking for the thoughts of others to help me see things from views and angles I have not thought of. I was not aware that I'm not supposed to ask questions, and If that's not a good thing or against the rules of the game, I apologise and will try as best I can to abstain.


I apologise, didn't mean to say or even imply that you speak for RWarehal, and certainly didn't mean to put words in his mouth. Your comment read to me as if you understood why RWarehall did what he did and the way he did it - I'm still not sure what to think of his actions, because that's exactly what I'd expect scum to do, while if he's town it doesn't look particularly friendly towards other townie winners, and since I can only be certain about myself, towards me.
I tried to present the implications in the second case, as I think the first one (him potentially being scum) is obvious. I failed to communicate that, and have made note of my failure; I will try my best to be clearer from now on.


I have not read the new posts yet, I will try to read them later, though I have a rather busy day today.

I have no problem with what Hyper said, or Hijack to an extent. I know how my posts can seem, so I understand that they could be seen as me trying not to be a lurker. I am trying to keep up with the thread as best I can, even if I'm still not sure what to pick up as a reason to find someone Scum. My reasons for not posting much of any worth is as I told Hyper, I am still not sure of things just yet.

Like I said, I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt and I believe you when you say it's your newness rather than being scum that's holding you back. Last game when I was scum I really struggled to know what to do and how to behave, and that showed. I'm not getting that from you, so if you're scum you're playing it a lot better than I did.

I, for one, don't want to participate in the lynch of a prize winner with the current knowledge we have, even though I'm not exactly comfortable with RWarehall. I don't want to be lynched either, I believe I'll be more helpful alive rather than dead, but I can't really justify the premature removal of a potentially helpful ability(s) based only on the interaction we had. The risk doesn't seem to be worth it.

Yes, it fells like his usual play style, and I'd expect the veterans to tell you the same. Still, I would not dismiss the case that he would use this to his advantage in the case he's scum. So, while it feels familiar, I am keeping an eye on him.


I'm not sure either about lots of things, so I understand where you're coming from. I'd just like to see you more actively involved, since you're here anyway. Take the part I highlighted in your post, for instance. You say that some of things you were thinking have been said by others. How about sharing the things you were thinking and have not been said already?


While this is true, have you considered that it's also what he'd use to his advantage if he's scum this time?


That's the thing though, at least for me as a newbie - I don't have a play style, I'm just trying to do the best I can which may not necessarily be good enough or even enough, period.

As for the lynch suggestion - as I said, I'm nowhere near building cases against anyone, so I'm glad we have time until we need to make a decision on that front, and I think we should focus on making the best out of it.

What books is referring to is that most if not all people tend to do specific stuff more often than not, even if it's not intentional. You say you don't have a style. While that may be true, I assure you that next time you play (given that you have something different about you, be it the role or the alignment), you are very likely to do something a bit differently and people who played with you in this game will jump you for it. That's just how the game works.

Well you would say that :P

I do know what you mean, and it is one of the reasons I was reluctant to take a side in it earlier. But it's the only thing so far that people seem to be looking at and taking sides over. And I can't see any of the scum popping in just to make a blatant mistake so we can jump on them.

Right now the scum don't really need to do anything, just sit back and wait till the deadline comes and we're forced to lynch someone (and right now it's looking like RWarehall might be the prime candidate for that). We all agree that out of the various incidents, no one is coming out actually looking scummy, and seeing as the players involved were mostly those who are also being quite active I can see us all just being town at each others throats.

I suggested scum lists and Ixam raised concerns about that. And while I do have him leaning slightly to scum I think they are at least reasonably valid. So we need some other method of scum hunting, because quite frankly I can't see there being any slips coming in the next week.

I'm starting to ramble now... But basically I think we need to stop waiting for the scum to hand us a lynch on a plate, and look at who is least helpful to town or most detrimental to town. JMich is till my prime candidate for that, but we have a lot of lurkers right now, and logic and probability suggests at least one (if not more) will be scum.

Can't we just try asking: "Scum, please raise you hand?" You never know, we might have a polite Scum player who will fall for it. :-)

I agree about not doing a list, at least not at the moment. As was previously said, it could be used to the Scum's advantage. It would give them a list of the most suspicious players (Town or Scum) that they could use to manipulate Town into lynching another Town, especially if we are mistaken and many high on a list are all Town.

I agree. Right now JMich is reminding me of how Krypsyn behaved last game, day 1 he popped in and out and kept saying he would come back and post more etc.

And he was scum (which I knew anyway, and therefore noticed the behaviour more as well).

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT

HijacK - 1 (RWarehall)
Ixamyakxim - 1 (DarkoD13)
dedoporno - 1 (trentonlf)
RWarehall – 2 (yogsloth, HijacK)
JMich - 2 (adaliabooks, Lifthrasil)
Robbeasy – 2 (Ixamyakxim, CSPVG)


Not Voting - All others