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arguments on gog forums
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tfishell: Something like that. The gist is this: I was indeed trying to facilitate open discussion by suggesting that people not shy away from realizing that GOG has flaws, and that constructive criticism can be a good thing.
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mondo84: Nobody is shying away from realizing GOG has flaws. Nobody is saying that criticism of GOG should be outlawed on these forums.

What they're shying away from is the repetitive statements about GOG being hypocritical and contradictory because they've given the customers the types of discounts and promos those same customers presenting the complaints asked for. The horse has died multiple times from the repeated beatings.

You're using straw man arguments, my friend. You're making claims against a position that few people, if any espouse (that GOG should be immune from criticism). And you're assuming that people used downvotes because they had kneejerk reactions to what was being said. I looked through and it seemed like the downvotes didn't come until later pages of the discussion. So, it was not because people were put off by the idea of criticism of GOG.

They were put off because the criticism being launched was inherently contradictory and established upon a flawed premise. And after pages of discussion about this, with things going in circles, people seemingly began to use downvotes because they didn't see further repetition of previous statements having any contribution to the discussion, other than causing consternation and discontent.

The criticism in that thread wasn't constructive. It was illogical and seemed to arise from bitterness, which again is strange because GOG has actually listened to people's criticisms and requests.

While you may be sincerely trying to encourage open discussion, what you actually seem to be doing is generalizing a large part of this community as not being receptive to any form of criticism whatsoever. You're making large, sweeping claims that, as I explained above, are based on false assumptions about people's motives. To be honest its coming off as a bit disingenuous and passive aggressive.

I really don't see this thread turning out better than the other one. :(
I'm kinda curious how you even know the exact reasoning of why people downvoted posts


And I know this sounds might sound kind of weak since I can't link any specific posts either (the gog search feature is atrocious), but from what I've seen there ARE some people who seem to act like gog shouldn't be criticized no matter what. But again...the search feature is horrible here and finding proof is difficult
Post edited November 21, 2012 by CaptainGyro
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mondo84: snip snap
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CaptainGyro: I'm kinda curious how you even know the exact reasoning of why people downvoted posts


And I know this sounds might sound kind of weak since I can't link any specific posts either (the gog search feature is atrocious), but from what I've seen there ARE some people who seem to act like gog shouldn't be criticized no matter what. But again...the search feature is horrible here and finding proof is difficult
The search is horrible! :)

I'm speculating, and I'm also going off memory of previous discussions about the nature of these arguments, voting, etc. I've read numerous posts of people saying they're tired of the arguments coming up frequently. So, I think some posters become exasperated and use the voting buttons instead of joining the discussion actively.

I know what you're suggesting, but I would hope that my posting suggests that I put more time and thought into responding to others.

But if people want to go on a witch hunt and find out who is most likely to have used the downvote button, I need to grab my pitch fork first!

;)
Post edited November 21, 2012 by mondo84
GOG's search feature is pretty bad! I have seen worse though, but I'm only bringing them up for laughs. Wikimedia's search is so awful you often can't find direct quotes taken from a page, not only on the first page, but at all. In fact, it seems like the more words you put in, the less reliable your results! Meanwhile, Kongregate again, which complicates your searches by mixing together games and forum posts, because it never bothered to ask which kind of thing you were looking for! At least GOG has two separate search boxes...

Both of which I've accidentally used for the other's purpose in the past...
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tfishell: So, in a nutshell, I guess what I'm suggesting is, you don't have to criticize GOG, but don't try to "block out" those who do.
If "blocking" means clicking the downvote button when one sees a message he doesn't agree with or a person he has personal vendetta with, I agree. For what it's worth, I feel those voting buttons, at least the downvote button, could be removed altogether. Currently they are misused, even by those who sometimes complain about them.

At the same time, it also seems that many of these people who complain "criticism towards GOG is not allowed in this forum, boohoo!" have double-standards, as they seem to complain about it whenever anyone disagrees with their criticism (ie. they don't like to see their criticism criticized, and whenever someone does, they complain that said person does not allow _ANY_ criticism towards GOG), and especially the ones who also complain that e.g. Steam should not be criticized here. Some even go to say that people in this forum should not defend GOG at all.

Just disagreeing with someone is not censorship.

I think it is natural that people who like a service hang around in its forums, and even defend the service in there if they _disagree_ with some criticism. For example, the big argument in the 5/10 thread was when certain someone was constanty blaming GOG of "bullshit PR", when at the same time he used the very same tactics claiming he trolls in these forums constantly just because he "cares" so much about the well-being of GOG. When you blame someone of something, first make sure you are not doing the same, ok?

The reason he (or anyone for that matter) doesn't want to see newer games in GOG is not because he is afraid of GOG going under, but because he personally doesn't want to buy new games from GOG. Yes, I am 130% certain his motives are purely selfish, just like for the most of us. For example, I want GOG to continue to promote DRM-free gaming (both on old and new games) simply because I prefer to buy DRM-free games. I don't try to sugar-coat it to bullshit PR like "I just worry that if GOG would start selling games with DRM, they would go bankcrupt... that's the reason why I oppose it, because We Care!".

It is silly for us mere users to even argue what is the best for GOG, as in "selling also newer games will destroy GOG as a company". I am confident GOG staff know the reality much better than us mere users, after all they are the ones who have all the relevant data. So I find it hilarious when someone acts as some kind of external expert who knows the best what is the best for GOG.
Post edited November 21, 2012 by timppu
low rated
GOG WINS HOW DARE YOU CRITICISE IT

/thread
It's horrible when Steam moderators act like Steam criticism is not welcome on their forum. It's equally horrible when people do that here, though at least we have no mods. No hypocrisy!

Though honestly I mock a lot of whining here just because it's whining.
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StingingVelvet: It's horrible when Steam moderators act like Steam criticism is not welcome on their forum. It's equally horrible when people do that here, though at least we have no mods. No hypocrisy!

Though honestly I mock a lot of whining here just because it's whining.
We have mods. They just don't mod much. :P
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TheEnigmaticT: We have mods. They just don't mod much. :P
If you ever need another I'm good at doing absolutely nothing.
I started playing Shadow Warrior yesterday and I am enjoying it.
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tfishell: (Reaction to the 5/10 dealio thread)
What the hell is that?
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TheEnigmaticT: We have mods. They just don't mod much. :P
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StingingVelvet: If you ever need another I'm good at doing absolutely nothing.
Lol :)
Post edited November 21, 2012 by gameon
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tfishell: (Reaction to the 5/10 dealio thread)
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gameon: What the hell is that?
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StingingVelvet: If you ever need another I'm good at doing absolutely nothing.
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gameon: Lol :)
http://www.gog.com/forum/general/special_promo_pick_5_pay_10/

The arguing seems to have died down, though (nicely).

Anyway, evidently people are taking what I posted in a variety of ways. You're welcome to say what you want (well, almost anything), and I won't downvote you. :P
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TheEnigmaticT: We have mods. They just don't mod much. :P
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StingingVelvet: If you ever need another I'm good at doing absolutely nothing.
you and me both but im not moving to Poland to do it.
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keeveek: GOG WINS HOW DARE YOU CRITICISE IT

/thread
I used the phrase "GOG wins" facetiously yesterday when doing some of the math behind the giveaway. Was a joke meant to play on the perceptions of extreme bias in favor of or against GOG, and I figured the silly nature of the post was enough to tip its playful hand.

Here's where I said GOG was wrong, and that the community in fact wins.

If that bothered you, I encourage you to come here and "hug it out, b*tch."

:)
Post edited November 21, 2012 by mondo84
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gameon: What the hell is that?


Lol :)
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tfishell: http://www.gog.com/forum/general/special_promo_pick_5_pay_10/

The arguing seems to have died down, though (nicely).

Anyway, evidently people are taking what I posted in a variety of ways. You're welcome to say what you want (well, almost anything), and I won't downvote you. :P
The voting post thing can be ridiculous at times. And active mods would be a welcome addition in my opinion. But GOG have said their stance on that, so we as a community will have to put up with the way the forum is, or change for better or worse.