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JudasIscariot: It's really bad when just about every damn car here is either German or French.
1) Germans sell their cars here but they buy our stuff as well. They are our biggest partner for importing and exporting goods
2) some of these cars are produced in Poland - like in VW manufacture near Poznan - one of the best in VW corp.
3) you can go to work to Germany or France – not a far trip.

You know what worries me? We (Eastern World, EU, US - you name it) have transferred production of too many products to China. Short-term it is nice because you get cheap product but long-term - you are staring to loose jobs. It is good to buy cheap LCDs – but no matter how cheap they are - for someone who has no job – it’s too expensive anyway. I’ve also heard that similar process could be obsreved for legal or financial services that are now being outsourced to India.
Post edited July 21, 2011 by tburger
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JudasIscariot: It's really bad when just about every damn car here is either German or French.
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tburger: 1) Germans sell their cars here but they buy our stuff as well. They are our biggest partner for importing and exporting goods
2) some of these cars are produced in Poland - like in VW manufacture near Poznan - one of the best in VW corp.
3) you can go to work to Germany or France – not a far trip.

You know what worries me? We (Eastern World, EU, US - you name it) have transferred production of too many articles to China. Short-term it is nice because you get cheap product but long-term - you are staring to loose jobs. It is good to buy cheap LCDs – but no matter how cheap they are - for someone who has no job – it’s too expensive anyway. I’ve also heard that similar process could be noticed for legal or financial services that are now being outsourced to India.
I think one of the primary reasons that factory jobs get outsourced is because unions start demanding more and more benefits. I remember in the States the automotive workers' unions got so many benefits, pay raises, and the ability to prevent, or at least make it very, very difficult for an employer to fire an ineffective union worker. I'm all for organizing a union of workers to prevent exploitation by the employer but when they start doing the exploiting that's when they shoot themselves in the foot.

Poland has also become one of the places to outsource bookkeeping and such. I think there are companies that handle the books for various overseas firms in Wroclaw.
Post edited July 21, 2011 by JudasIscariot
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JudasIscariot: Poland has also become one of the places to outsource bookkeeping and such. I think there are companies that handle the books for various overseas firms in Wroclaw.
True, but as EU/US imports our labour (like bookkeeping services) we import A LOT from them - so it's a mutual profit. Can you think of sth that we can export to China ?
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JudasIscariot: Poland has also become one of the places to outsource bookkeeping and such. I think there are companies that handle the books for various overseas firms in Wroclaw.
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tburger: True, but as EU/US imports our labour (like bookkeeping services) we import A LOT from them - so it's a mutual profit. Can you think of sth that we can export to China ?
For Poland, there is nothing we can really export to China since China uses protectionism to make sure Chinese companies are their preferred companies for anything and I don't think we produce much of anything that we can export to them. Yes, we produce cars but they are either German or Italian brands for the EU market. We did export some entertainment to them. I read about some Polish group who made an album in Chinese and sold tons of copies over there. Germany sold them a crapload of Mercedes-Benz vehicles.

I seriously think that China is pulling a price dumping scheme on the rest of the world. Price everything low enough to drive the competition out of business then jack the prices up once they have near total control. When the production capabilities of Western countries crumble we'll see China do this.
I don't think US or EU are stupid enough to declare war on China - OVER A BILLION NATION, and a country that can destroy economics of any other country just by stopping the export to it.

Oh man, US or EU declaring war on China.. That would be the end of United States and Europe, as Russia would join China GLADLY ;-)
Post edited July 21, 2011 by keeveek
They could always hit Microsoft with another anti-trust suit.

@keeveek
You don't have to openly declare war to actually go to war, and "war" doesn't always mean "bombs and guns and jets and tanks". There's use of propaganda to turn the youngest generation against the gov't, there's sabotage (which doesn't just mean "throwing a spanner into a factory"; you can sabotage a country's food supply by introducing a nasty crop-eating disease, or even just lots of rats and locusts), etc.
Post edited July 21, 2011 by predcon
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keeveek: ... as Russia would join China GLADLY ;-)
I wouldn't be sure about it. China and Russia may look as allies, but only against USA.
In reality there is a silent fight for influence in Asia.
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keeveek: ... as Russia would join China GLADLY ;-)
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v1989: I wouldn't be sure about it. China and Russia may look as allies, but only against USA.
In reality there is a silent fight for influence in Asia.
It might be, but when it comes to divide Europe between Russia and China, I tihnk they would be allies;-)
Post edited July 21, 2011 by keeveek
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v1989: I wouldn't be sure about it. China and Russia may look as allies, but only against USA.
In reality there is a silent fight for influence in Asia.
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keeveek: It might be, but when it comes to divide Europe between Russia and China, I tihnk they would be allies;-)
Why would Russia give part of Europe to China?:]
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tburger: ...
You know what worries me? We (Eastern World, EU, US - you name it) have transferred production of too many products to China. Short-term it is nice because you get cheap product but long-term - you are staring to loose jobs. It is good to buy cheap LCDs – but no matter how cheap they are - for someone who has no job – it’s too expensive anyway. ...
That is division of labour. Everybody specialises in something he is especially good in and exchanges these goods with the trade partners. In the end everybody wins because the combined output is higher than the sum of single isolated output if everybody would have to do everything. Only it has to be in balance. Since we are living in a globalized world, we surely compete with the whole world. That's a tough situation, but in the past we all profited from cheap chinese products, because so we could consume even more, but there always has to be a balance and we should not forget that these chinese products are so cheap because the social standards and legal rights in china are much lower, it's not a democracy. We probably would need much stronger chinese unions or something like this. ;)

When I was young I never understood that communism and capitalism can fit so wonderful together but now I can just say, that the value of the common worker is almost equal in both and therefore it just fits.
Post edited July 21, 2011 by Trilarion
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keeveek: It might be, but when it comes to divide Europe between Russia and China, I tihnk they would be allies;-)
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v1989: Why would Russia give part of Europe to China?:]
Because fight with Europe AND China at the same time would be dangerous for Russia. Also, attacking Europe by itself.

Russia and China invades Europe, and AFTER that they would start killing each other. In that order :P
Well, the gold era of cheap chinese product is slowly ending.
I'm just really glad the UK stayed out of it. I can't even begin to imagine how screwed up our economy would be if we had the Euro.
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v1989: Well, the gold era of cheap chinese product is slowly ending.
Soon, our bicycles will produced on Mars, if the movie Mr.Nobody has anything to say about it :P
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v1989: Well, the gold era of cheap chinese product is slowly ending.
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JudasIscariot: Soon, our bicycles will produced on Mars, if the movie Mr.Nobody has anything to say about it :P
First, we have to get somehow on Mars. USA stopped production of space shuttles.:D