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vv221: That’s of course wrong, youngsters today are not more stupid than we were at their age, and they are usually more tech-savvy than we were. They could setup TCP/IP multiplayer easily, if the developers were not robbing us of this option in favour of DRM everywhere.
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toxicTom: As a parent I can simply say "not true". ;-)

Not just from my own kids.
Indeed. The "digital native" is a myth. Indeed, it's late GenX/Early GenY who appear to be "peak troubleshooters" because everyone had to be as computers proliferated. But then, things became "stable enough" that it hit masses without it. And today's "throw away and replace" has again made troubleshooters/"techies" a niche group.

Web search for "myth digital native" for some back-up articles.

EDIT: Wrote this a while ago, never hit post. Oops.
Post edited March 11, 2021 by mqstout
high rated
Stronghold: Warlords has minor cosmetic DRM disguised as a registration bonus too.

https://imgur.com/a/gEIRVPO

Companies need to get the fuck over this "register your game with us!" bullshit. If someone wants to opt into a mailing list, sure, ask them to. But don't lock game content behind that!

This one verifies the email, requires signing up for newsletter, clicking a link in the confirmation email, and responds "Your exclusive Lord skins will download automatically the next time you launch Stronghold: Warlords". It also appears to blacklist certain email addresses (such as mailinator) with a nebulous "server error".

Addendum: In-game directions to change language refer to Galaxy. (I installed via Galaxy.) I don't know if the offline installers include languages or not. https://imgur.com/a/MaIULgg
Post edited March 11, 2021 by mqstout
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mqstout: Stronghold: Warlords has minor cosmetic DRM disguised as a registration bonus too.

https://imgur.com/a/gEIRVPO

Companies need to get the fuck over this "register your game with us!" bullshit. If someone wants to opt into a mailing list, sure, ask them to. But don't lock game content behind that!

This one verifies the email, requires signing up for newsletter, clicking a link in the confirmation email, and responds "Your exclusive Lord skins will download automatically the next time you launch Stronghold: Warlords". It also appears to blacklist certain email addresses (such as mailinator) with a nebulous "server error".

Addendum: In-game directions to change language refer to Galaxy. (I installed via Galaxy.) I don't know if the offline installers include languages or not. https://imgur.com/a/MaIULgg
Thanks for the notice.

@all: can someone check, whether it is possible to change the language in the offline version?
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Lifthrasil: @all: can someone check, whether it is possible to change the language in the offline version?
Yes the installer asks you which language you want to install. Also to be correct the skins in question are only for the multiplayer and the skirmish mode (multiplayer with bots which can be offline though), not for the single player campaigns nor the free build mode.
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Gersen: skirmish mode (multiplayer with bots which can be offline though)
Translation: not multiplayer at all.
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KetobaK: It's quite some work actually, it can take month of work if you put a cuople of developers to do it, code it, test it, see if work, support it, and is like wasted work if you already have a working solution that use a launcher like this :/
That is a laughable amount of work. A month? REALLY?
That's a drop in an ocean of general dev work on a game.
Even if your game is already released and for months you sit and do nothing but patches.
Also:
So then what do you say for the fact that GOG Galaxy API is nowhere near compatible with steamworks and majority of games released here require recoding a whole lot of netcode?
It's usually not the case of simply changing steam syscalls for gog ones.
Considering that GOG API is of "questionable quality" I dare to say such process could take actually more than a month.

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Time4Tea: As far as I am concerned, any dependency on a remote server for multiplayer is DRM, because the developer is effectively retaining a 'kill switch' for the game. The moment they decide to turn off the server, the MP game is instantly unplayable for anyone that has bought it.
You probably meant "any dependency on developers' remote server" ?

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KetobaK: 1000% agree with you (yes, thousands, I can't agree more), direct methods for MP are always better, and like you said would be far better for preservation, I also hate remote servers, that's why barely play modern MP games (prefer the classics like Quake Arena I play to this day), but for younger audiences the lonely concept of use an IP to connect in a MP game cause them severe brain damage, that's why developers choose adapt their game to remote servers like Steam.
Except, you know, there is quite considerable amount of games on Steam that do not use steamworks backend for multiplayer and actually require you to rtfm.
For example Destiny 2, which has pretty loooong troubleshooting page on developer's website in regards to "connectivity issues".
There are also games that use steamworks backend but also other ports at the same time.

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Time4Tea: The thing is: why can't they do both? With the client-server model, the developer could have their own instance of the MP server running for gamer convenience (with a handy link built in to the game) and also provide the server application along with the game, for future preservation, once the remote server gets turned off.
Except it is usually not that simple.
You would also have to have an option to use community stats/realm/matchmaking/whatever server otherwise you would end up with still "the end".
One example is Battlefield Play4Free.
It is fair to say that most servers were not developers' just 3rd party (not exactly community per se, they were running on community/clan/sites funded 3rd party [NOT developers'] infrastructure) but the game still relied on developers' central server for some data storage so when "the developer" decided to show active community a finger the dedicated hosting didn't matter.
I went pretty in depth on the whole "multiplayer netcode" matter in post 373 ( https://www.gog.com/forum/general/drm_on_gog_list_of_singleplayer_games_with_drm/post373 ) and I don't feel like repeating myself.
I brought some related points there so if anyone is interested go read it.

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KetobaK: for younger audiences the lonely concept of use an IP to connect in a MP game cause them severe brain damage
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vv221: That’s of course wrong, youngsters today are not more stupid than we were at their age, and they are usually more tech-savvy than we were. They could setup TCP/IP multiplayer easily, if the developers were not robbing us of this option in favour of DRM everywhere.
I highly disagree.
I am in IT industry and had plenty of exposure of help desk (I hate it btw, because I hate stupidity, and private users represent it too much) over the time, mostly freelance, and honestly, the people born for example post 2000 aren't ACTUALLY more technology proficient.
They pick up smartphones and BASIC usage of computers more easily than some % of previous generations.
But this has nothing to do with their age or whatever.
It's because technology now is easier to obtain, thus more popular, thus easier to pick up from the general society.
Believe me, those "youngsters" not only aren't better with "higher than absolute rock bottom intermediate" than earlier generations, they are often WORSE.
I have seen quite some people who for example were tought Win 8 interface and couldn't use "normal" interfaces.

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mqstout: Indeed, it's late GenX/Early GenY who appear to be "peak troubleshooters"
Which years exactly are those supposed to be?

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Lifthrasil: @all: can someone check, whether it is possible to change the language in the offline version?
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Gersen: Yes the installer asks you which language you want to install.
Ah yes, "reinstall the game to change the language". Which year is this again? /s
*sigh*
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mqstout: Companies need to get the fuck over this "register your game with us!" bullshit. If someone wants to opt into a mailing list, sure, ask them to. But don't lock game content behind that!
Yep. The Telltale Batman game asks me to register with Telltale every. Single. Time. And I don't see any way to tell it to fuck off permanently. I'm not saying it's DRM or anything, but it is freaking annoying. I've no idea if there is anything locked behind that registration. It says "to get full experience", but the only feature mentioned anywhere are cloud saves.
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Breja: Telltale Batman
I don't know Batman, but if it's like TWD was, I would guess it's to be able to contribute to the "the community made these decisions at this point" statistics you can get after you complete the game to see how you went with and against most players. That's a big if though. Annoying. The Stronghold one has a "dismiss permanently" if you don't want the skins.
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Gersen: Yes the installer asks you which language you want to install.
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B1tF1ghter: Ah yes, "reinstall the game to change the language". Which year is this again? /s *sigh*
Thus is the problem with audio narration and speech in videos. Either you're wasting a ton of disk space on multilingual support (this game isn't a lot, but a lot of bigger, like AAA games, this is SIGNIFICANT where you're looking at multiple gigabytes per language), or you have to install languages as needed. I'm glad offline installers let you choose which to install, else this would be a case of "languages require Galaxy" -- which would have been bad.

There are numerous games that do languages as free DLC, or those that have low quality packed-in multilanguage support and have free DLC for high quality multilanguage support.
Post edited March 13, 2021 by mqstout
low rated
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toxicTom: As a parent I can simply say "not true". ;-)

Not just from my own kids.
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mqstout: Indeed. The "digital native" is a myth. Indeed, it's late GenX/Early GenY who appear to be "peak troubleshooters" because everyone had to be as computers proliferated. But then, things became "stable enough" that it hit masses without it. And today's "throw away and replace" has again made troubleshooters/"techies" a niche group.

Web search for "myth digital native" for some back-up articles.

EDIT: Wrote this a while ago, never hit post. Oops.
Add to this list of troubles the attempt at locking down tech so you can't root/jailbreak or install "unauthorized software." Seems we saw the golden age come and go.
Synthetik: Legion Rising has content only available through a newsletter subscription (allegedly the code you get is universal, but I'm not sure it's possible to input the code without being online with Galaxy anyway) and other content locked behind referral codes. I think at least some of the referral code content can be unlocked by playing Synthetik: Arena and/or having the DLC for it, but given that neither that game nor its DLC are available on GOG this alternative isn't available here anyway. Also not sure if referral codes could be used without an internet connection, though I suspect they require it.
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TheEndedSkull: Synthetik: Legion Rising has content only available through a newsletter subscription (allegedly the code you get is universal, but I'm not sure it's possible to input the code without being online with Galaxy anyway) and other content locked behind referral codes. I think at least some of the referral code content can be unlocked by playing Synthetik: Arena and/or having the DLC for it, but given that neither that game nor its DLC are available on GOG this alternative isn't available here anyway. Also not sure if referral codes could be used without an internet connection, though I suspect they require it.
Thank you!

Can someone check, whether Galaxy or an internet connection is required for using these referral codes?

In any case I just saw that the game page states that Galaxy is required for co-op. So on the multplayer DRM list it goes.
Post edited March 16, 2021 by Lifthrasil
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Gersen: Yes the installer asks you which language you want to install.
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B1tF1ghter: Ah yes, "reinstall the game to change the language". Which year is this again? /s
*sigh*
So you think it would be better to install every language of a game (which might take quite a lot od disk space depending on the game) so that it will be possible to change it with an ini setting? I am still angry that GOG decided to put all languages in the CP2077 installer and hope they'll reconsider.
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B1tF1ghter: Ah yes, "reinstall the game to change the language". Which year is this again? /s
*sigh*
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MarkoH01: So you think it would be better to install every language of a game (which might take quite a lot od disk space depending on the game) so that it will be possible to change it with an ini setting? I am still angry that GOG decided to put all languages in the CP2077 installer and hope they'll reconsider.
I'm saying modular design of both installer and install itself is the best.
Where you could have language packs as bins or whatever and one universal language-patcher-installer.
One master bin for assets and "non language stuff". Plus main installer.
The language bins would be automatically recognized by the main installer and you could pick which ones you want to install.
Later you could use ini to switch the installed ones.
And you could use stand alone language-patcher-installer to install / purge some new / old ones.
That's the solution I personally see as the best one.
high rated
Yep. Language-packs that are separate from the main installation files would be the best way to handle language in offline installers.
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TheEndedSkull: Synthetik: Legion Rising has content only available through a newsletter subscription (allegedly the code you get is universal, but I'm not sure it's possible to input the code without being online with Galaxy anyway) and other content locked behind referral codes. I think at least some of the referral code content can be unlocked by playing Synthetik: Arena and/or having the DLC for it, but given that neither that game nor its DLC are available on GOG this alternative isn't available here anyway. Also not sure if referral codes could be used without an internet connection, though I suspect they require it.
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Lifthrasil: Thank you!

Can someone check, whether Galaxy or an internet connection is required for using these referral codes?

In any case I just saw that the game page states that Galaxy is required for co-op. So on the multplayer DRM list it goes.
I tried the game offline without galaxy and I see no option whatsoever to input those codes. Apparently you can (or could?) open the console with Delete key but it's not working for me. Maybe you have to be online or in coop mode or sth.